Arms Licensing just a big Joke

[ABABUJAY]

HI GUYS,
Today i spoke to a police officer reg issue of license , you a can quote only to purpose
1 On self protection grounds
2 sport
You have provide the following details for self protection grounds

Nature of threat -direct or indirect,
Threat from- family members, terrorist, antisocial elements, business rivals, armed mobs, criminals gangs , robbers, etc
Any past incidents of threat, if so the fir copy of the complaint u lodged .
or any theft incident in your area, neighbours and their fir copy
And also based on your compliant you have to specify if any security is given to you ( z or a, b ,c or some thing similar to that),
So u have to produce all these details if u apply for arms license on self protection grounds
and for sport purpose
You can’t become a member today and apply for a license tomorrow,
become a member,
practice for 3 to 5 months with air rifle,
get a copy of you attendance in the rifle club,
take part in air rifle competition,
weather u perform or not get a certificate that u took part,
and now apply for the license ,tell them u want to upgrade to 5o mts shooting .
this will give you a good result, and they cannot deny ur application on any grounds
regards
babu

[goodboy_mentor]

Nature of threat -direct or indirect,
Threat from- family members, terrorist, antisocial elements, business rivals, armed mobs, criminals gangs , robbers, etc
Any past incidents of threat, if so the fir copy of the complaint u lodged .
or any theft incident in your area, neighbours and their fir copy
And also based on your compliant you have to specify if any security is given to you ( z or a, b ,c or some thing similar to that),

I regret to write, why do we have to listen to these dictations. Have these police officers become a law unto themselves because of our mental dumbness? Where in Arms Act above conditions are written? A threat does not have to be from a known quarter, it can happen any time/any place. Will a robber give you a threat before raiding your house? Will a kidnapper come to kidnap you after threatening you? Will armed mobs intimate you before attacking you, so that you can apply for a arms license?

Don't we have a simple sense to question these kind of conditions that are propagated?

All this nonsensical logic of these so called police officers is really sickening, why are we listening and respecting all this nonsense?

[ABABUJAY]

DEAR MENTOR,
First of all we should know one thing, every one in life have some threat, no one in this world is without threat, ONLY THE PROBABILITY MATTERS.

So government can’t grant license for every citizen in India, applying for arms license on protection grounds.
The police see the likelihood of the threat to occur
It’s our duty to prove and convince, them bout the probability.
The law regarding license is a generalized one, it can b fine tuned by the commissioner depending upon the present situation in the state.
In case any one misuses his\her license, all the cops involved in the procedure, will be in real trouble
Hope u know a incident in which a guy who concealed a bomb in his shoes and was bout to blow a flight, only after that incident security people started scanning the shoes,
So we can’t argue with them quoting laws.

This is my personal opinion, even i am frustrated by the licensing procedure, but i have to think from their side also
Regards
babu

[goodboy_mentor]

First of all we should know one thing, every one in life have some threat, no one in this world is without threat, ONLY THE PROBABILITY MATTERS.

Indirectly you are justifying the discriminatory attitude of the government. So the life of a person with apparent lesser probability of threat to life should be discriminated against and persons like "VVIPs" who can jack up their threat probability on papers, should be armed/protected not just by Indian made arms, but by imported arms. The so called "threat probability" is nothing but a clever and cunning excuse to shut the sane voice of gullible Indians. Did that Manu Sharma who shot Jessica Lal, get not only the license but a seized revolver from customs at concessional rate because he had higher "threat probability" or because he was a son of a politician? Did son of Promod Mahajan get license because of higher "threat probability" or because he was son of a politician? Come on let us open our eyes to reality and not rely on just what is said to us by somebody in the establishment.

So government can’t grant license for every citizen in India, applying for arms license on protection grounds.

So government has problem granting license to every law abiding citizen, because government discriminates about the value of life about every citizen as per its own perceptions based on some whims and fancies. Whereas every criminal can purchase illegal arms as per choice and attack you and me, who should be at mercy of the decision of licensing authority.

This is my personal opinion, even i am frustrated by the licensing procedure, but i have to think from their side also

Please keep on reinforcing the above attitudes, take care of their brilliant point of view and stay frustrated, or stand up to protest against being at mercy of somebody else to take decision about YOUR right to defend YOUR life and those of your near and dear ones. It is YOUR choice, YOU decide.

[tingriman]

First of all we should know one thing, every one in life have some threat, no one in this world is without threat, ONLY THE PROBABILITY MATTERS

Then you must comeout with a nice mathematical formula to calculate the probability, and the probability calculated by DC in your case is not hight enough ........ is the What you want to Say???????

even i am frustrated by the licensing procedure, but i have to think from their side also

Which side my dear, from what angle ???


cheers,
tingriman

[saahil]

Well he is the continuation to the problem.
Does not listen to the bureaucrats the home minister called him in recommendation of the file he had a simple reply " i am looking into the file and will process it when all the procedures are done"

I am strong build with 6.1 feet height and good body so there is no chance that he will reject it on the grounds of physical appearance.

My file is personally recommended by the local SP he is the highest post of police in our area.
Also we have been awarded as the best business people of the year by the chief minister of Karnataka.
The DC also had to state this that licenses should not be issued for business purpose. where as in Arms rules of 1962 clearly stated in chapter 13(2) that a license can be issued to a business.

I also told him that we are having petrol pumps and we need to carry cash around so we need protection. Also all this time we had a license in the family in my uncles name.
Just that we are surrendering that license and taking one in my name.

I would be really great full in case someone could suggest me which rifle club i could join and i mean easily and also the club which is registering members because the clubs i have inquired abt just have to say that they are closed for the time being.

Also i would request all the IFG members to find the case where the judge has given a ruling that the application has to be granted or rejected in 3 months time.

also one more thing that the DC Does not get transferred for the next 3 years.
The best part of the issuance comes here. He does not reject the file nor does he approve it. It just remains in the computer as pending files.
Guys please help. This is going to set an example for everyone to do something to get ourselves the deserving licenses and weapons.

Help me fight this out and i will bring this entire episode to the media on the big way. ( I SWEAR ) I am really so so frustrated.

hi mr jalan
this three months norm is not a ruling made by any court of law.its just an order passed by our state home ministry(govt.of rajasthan)to the licensing authorities that they have to decide a case(with nagative or positive approach) in within three months from the application date.after reading your letter it seems that the DC is under the impression that he have to pay for your gun if he will issue the license.is he having any problem with you,these bureaucrats are real egoistic,if you pressurise them with any political approach they start taking things personally.wish you luck.take care.

[nagarifle]

(quote)In case any one misuses his\her license, all the cops involved in the procedure, will be in real trouble (quote/)

this is an impossible statement. let me say this to you. if you go to doctor and ask him to give you a clean health chit, he will do so, the Dr will state that he has examined you on sush and such date and your fit and strong. if you ask him to make a statement that next week you are going to be healthy as last week. he will not sign any such thing.

The UK firearms application forms needs to be attested by two people who are not family members. on the form it states that the person who attests is not responsible for what the applicant might do next year.

what they want is how are you do day.

threats changes like in the 1984 riots in Delhi etc, today there are no such things.

oh ya do the cops have a crystal ball from which they can predict what you will be doing tomorrow?

[ABABUJAY]

Hi frends,
I am not discouraging or supporting any one here,
Laws and Acts are not prepared in one night, instead made with an intention to safe guard people, property, democracy, etc,etc based on past bad events.

[b]Indirectly you are justifying the discriminatory attitude of the government[/b]
We know that any one with a criminal back ground are not eligible to obtain an arms license, but a guy who was a criminal in the past and has really repented now asks for a license
And if u are the issuing authority, will u grant him license?
And in fact he has got more threat than a common man.
If he is denied license then will you call that as a human right violation and discrimination?


its own perceptions based on some whims and fancies.
If you can provide solid evidence for your need , than merely stating it in the application, perception and interpretation will be impossible

Then you must come out with a nice mathematical formula to calculate the probability, and the probability calculated by DC in your case is not hight enough ........ is the What you want to Say???????
Frend its just a comparative term, Ms Dhoni is more prone to naxal attack than a common man like me LIVING IN CHENNAI
And I have applied for purely sport purpose and till now they have not rejected my application, I have provided enough documents and I will get my license, only time matters.
And dear friends what do they gain in rejecting your application and lose by granting u the same?
Regards
babu

[goodboy_mentor]

Laws and Acts are not prepared in one night, instead made with an intention to safe guard people, property, democracy, etc,etc based on past bad events.

Dear ABABUJAY this is the fundamental mistake you are making. Gun control laws do not control firearms going into hands of criminals. Gun control laws are basically a smokescreen by politicians to give a false sense of security to people. Do you seriously believe that criminals go to the licensing authority to apply for firearm license and commit crime using a licensed firearm so that they can get convicted by court by matching the signature of the bullet to their gun? Do you seriously believe criminals are having difficulty acquiring illegal arms?

We know that any one with a criminal back ground are not eligible to obtain an arms license, but a guy who was a criminal in the past and has really repented now asks for a license
And if u are the issuing authority, will u grant him license?

Yes of course he has the right to defend his life like any other citizen and should get a license. If he is not given a license, it is nothing but a discrimination. Absolutely I would grant license to everyone except only 2 categories: Mentally insane and proclaimed offenders who are evading the due course of law. If a criminal has intention to commit a crime, he does not need to go to a licensing authority, they have their own ways of procuring illegal firearms without much difficulty. It appears you are not aware illegal firearms are available much cheaper than legal firearms and can be disposed off after crime.

If you can provide solid evidence for your need , than merely stating it in the application, perception and interpretation will be impossible

Wish all the innocent people killed in this country by criminals could have got a "solid evidence" before a crime was going to happen, what a logic? God Bless our nation and these kind of ideas. Wish all the innocent people killed by terrorists, in 1984 riots, in gujarat riots, 26/11 etc. etc could provide "solid evidence" before getting arms licenses to defend themselves. You can think of such ideas only because you have not been so unfortunate like those innocent people.

Frend its just a comparative term, Ms Dhoni is more prone to naxal attack than a common man like me LIVING IN CHENNAI

It is not a comparative term but a clever excuse to deny license. People killed by terrorists, in 1984 riots, in gujrat riots, 26/11 etc. etc could they ever foresee, "prove" or "calculate" the probability of such events. Does it mean those people did not have any right to defend their lives? Question of probability is irrelevant if we value life of every citizen as equal. You can think of such ideas only because you have not been so unfortunate like these people. Yes of course people in Chennai should have the same right to defend and value their life, like Dhoni etc. living in Naxal infected areas. Why should people in Chennai not have the same right like that of Mr. Dhoni? Are the lives of people living in Chennai any less valuable than Dhoni etc. because some babus in the establishment think so?

[winnie_the_pooh]

I can't visualize Dhoni taking on a whole band of Naxals with his 'deadly' 9mm PB pistol

Is Mumbai a Naxal infested area

http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report_w ... ed_1304008

What about Chennai

http://www.hindu.com/2004/06/22/stories ... 000300.htm

Licensed firearms can enable a person to defend himself from random acts of violence that can take place anywhere in the country.It also enables the more vulnerable(woman and the elderly) to counter the advantage that their assailant/s has/have in strength or numbers.

[goodboy_mentor]

[sunilnuguri]

Hi..

No Point in Approaching the DC any more ..

My Advice you better approach the Principal Home Secretary at the Secratariat . he is the only person who can directly Grant an Arms License (all india permit)... but you need to keep the Home Minister in loop with a phone call to him.
and some other favors if needed .

reg..sunil
hyderabad
sunilnuguri

Posts: 2
Age: 33
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2009 2:25 pm
Location: HYDERABAD
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[cottage cheese]

Are the lives of people living in Chennai any less valuable than Dhoni etc. because some babus in the establishment think so?

Its the feudal mindset that refuses to go in spite of independence. The lords (Popular figures/privileged) are revered as higher beings and automatically accorded enormous respect. Exactly why third rate film stars are often addressed as 'Sir'...and things like that.

The establishment/babu recognizes and gives way only to seniority, rank, privilege and material. Merit, talent, ability, honesty are very low in the criteria. That is also how we don't have imaginative, creative and broad minded governance - because thinking out of the box is discouraged and potentially good public servants are snuffed out within a short time of joining service.

[goodboy_mentor]

Its the feudal mindset that refuses to go in spite of independence. The lords (Popular figures/privileged) are revered as higher beings and automatically accorded enormous respect. Exactly why third rate film stars are often addressed as 'Sir'...and things like that.

"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere."
- Voltaires

"Never underestimate the power of fools in large groups."
- Author Unknown (applicable to voters in India, who vote similar people into power)

"Power does not corrupt men; fools, however, if they get into a position of power, corrupt power."
— George Bernard Shaw (applicable to our leaders and bureaucrats)

"In Greece wise men speak and fools decide."
- George Santayana (applicable to the present situation in India)

[vkjalan]

Dear IFG Members,
Here is the continuation i have found out that my file has still not been rejected or accepted.

So if i apply for an RTI the reply i may get is that the file is under process.

Is there anything specific i can write to get the file's exact status and also the reason for the delay in processing the application.

Please give me suggestions. And also some examples if possible.
Waiting for your early reply thank you.