IFG Members support for RKBA PIL

[mundaire]

I haven't voted yet, but I am not convinced that PIL on these issues would stand muster in a court of law. No court is going to direct the government to amend the EXIM (export/ import) policy in favour of opening up imports of firearms/ munitions for civilians.

Similarly I doubt if the courts will interfere in the licensing process, as on paper the process seems fair enough:- apply -> the police does a verification of your antecedents -> if you have no black marks against you, you get your license. Of course we all know, that in practice it seldom works in this manner!

Also, someone has been talking about making exceptions for members of associations/ clubs etc. (I think it was RottLord), well by making such a suggestion are you not suggesting the creation of another bastion of privilege? The law should be the same for everyone, and RKBA does not refer to the right of club/ association members to keep and bear arms, it refers to EVERYONE and that is what is needed... that includes everyone from your poor farmer, street side vendor, rickshaw puller, etc. all the way up to the President of India enjoying the same right on an equal footing. Till such time as even gun/ shooting enthusiasts fail to understand this, I see little hope in this movement developing into anything substantial.

I personally feel and have always maintained, if we want things to change we need to lobby the government/ law makers directly... that and only that is the route which will lead to effective change.

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[gunrunner]

Hi Abhijeet,
The licensing process is indeed clean on paper,on paper lot of other goverment decisions look clean.The truth is otherwise.
Wether we succeed or not,is a different question.We need to put it in black and white to the authorities that the people dont approve of their actions,and would not stop approaching the courts to sort out things.
Lifting the IMPORT BAN isnt what we are fighting.

We are possibly filing a PIL for easy issue of Arms Licences.-Am I Correct Folks.

We can fight the ban later.One step at a time.I am sure the ban on small arms can be fought and won hands down.At least for shooters.

The arguement of the police dept and its chief for not giving licences is,that will raise the crime graf.
Commissioner Sir,you are mis-informed,save an except,a Pravin Mahajan,which other crimes are committed by Licensed Weapons,in the recent past.
Why was Pravin Mahajan given a arms licence,simply because he was Gopinath Munde's brother in law and also The Great Pramod Mhajan's brother.
In future if one wants a licence desperately i would suggest marrying a cops sister,or a politicians sister,as the only option.
The cops and politicos are ruling the state as their personal fiefdoms.As if they own the state and its resources and machinery.

If they are granting licences to their saala's,jeeja's and chamchas,what wrong are we tax payers doing to be denied a licence.Inspite of having strong credentials.

RKBA is every citizens fundamental right.
Time we drilled it into the dept's empty cranial cavity.

The bane of democracy is its bueraucracy.

What nobody wants to do......Somebody has to do.......

[monishthakoor]

YES

Monish

[Rottmeister]

Till someone comes up with a better plan, let's follow the current course of action. The counter points been mentioned are similar to break an entire wall to get to the other side, whereas mine are similar to install a doorway in the wall for humans to pass through. Granting a license always depends on protocols and registering with a club and getting one seems to be the easiest. And as far as importing goes, the memberships shall provide the necessary buffer.

We, Indians, "No" too much; it's the high time we add to it the necessary 'D' .

[coltpython]

YES

[tingriman]

Till someone comes up with a better plan, let's follow the current course of action. .

Let us atleast start the journey.

cheers
tingriman

[ravi.sharma]

Hi Abhijeet,

I could summarize 3 points out of your post, which concern you, whether or not this PIL shall hold its value in court of LAW.

1) Court wont be able to give directives to Govenrment for EXIM policies.
2) For Courts, the procedure for obtaining ARMS liecense is already streamlined and simple, so no point of discussion on this point.
3) Need good lobby with Government / Law Makers.

I would like to share my point of view on above;

1) As of now, the only best option available with us is to file a PIL in court and be heard, even if it is rejected their shall be a next course of action and of more inputs to direct the case in a more aggressive manner infront of the right authorities.

2) Infact, i strongly beleive, this topic can fetch some good points in our favour. If, we have a good support of people when we file the PIL. Proper evidence and be put in to place, wherein the members have applied for the liecese and the police have rejected it, Inspite of a good and strong Track Record, on the other hand the liecense have been issued to the people, who have criminal records.

3) As your self, I also strongly beleive in this point but please tell me one thing, when do the politicians support some one The answer is, only when they get benefitted out of it. When, we are planning to file PIL, it wont be just a simple affair of IFG members being involved and rest of the general public not even aware of something like this is going on in courts. We need to make this thing big, get it a decent publicity if not a big one. That will be the time, where we will face a lot of critics and controversies ( CONTROVERSIES CREATE CASH and PUBLICITY). That is what we have to capitalize on, to ensure we get some politicians associated with us and maximum definetly will walk parallel to us. I have contacts and methods to obtain this but for that we will have to agree to support this cause and lay down the path slowly and steadily. This will also help in geting people to visit IFG site, which in it self is full of knowledge and encouragement for LAW abiding citizens. The site will speak for our cause.

I know, the next point will be that "it is not as simple as it looks" and I also know that but " the path to success has also never been simple".

Few famous proverbs, thought i will just post it.

Edward Ericson:
The cosmos is neither moral or immoral; only people are. He who would move the world must first move himself.

Franklin D. Roosevelt:
It is common sense to take a method and try it. If it fails, admit it frankly and try another. But above all, try something.

Frederick Douglass:
Those who profess to favor freedom and yet depreciate agitation, are people who want crops without ploughing the ground; they want rain without thunder and lightning; they want the ocean without the roar of its many waters. The struggle may be a moral one, or it may be a physical one, or it may be both. But it must be a struggle. Power concedes nothing without a demand; it never has and it never will.



Ravi.

[amit888_2000]

hi, guys, i am in, and also gave my vote earlier....I am a NRAI member....anything for me, pls PM me...

I had discussion with 2 lawyers, 1st likes to help us out, 2nd says, court will not listen to you at the admission of ur PIL or may be ur PIL will not get admitted , as courts do not interfear with lawmakers, thay interfear with the implementation of that law...........so guys, I mean lets fight...

Basically we all want a new system...I am in....))))cheers!!!!

Amit

[goodboy_mentor]

.

[Rottmeister]

The willing ones know better how each of them may be of help. I suggest them to send PMs to Vikram and Ravi narrating how you may with your drive, contacts and accesses; only then a concrete plan can be devised.

[vkjalan]

Yeah for sure !

[Rottmeister]

Hello VK! May I ask you to click on the poll options? That shall show the count. Thank you.

[Happy]

"Yes",
Do we have a lawyer by profession and a gunlover on this forum ? , maybe he could shed more light on filing a PIL and could also guide us regarding the same.
Regards
Happy

[ravi.sharma]

Hi Abhijeet,

I am trying to send you a P.M but its not getting thru, could you please P.M your email id.


Ravi.

[joydeepm]

A definite YES . With you guys ..all the way .