We are well and truly b.....d-Plight of Indian gun lovers

[Grumpy]

Yes, all true Vikram, but even so a post-war Conservative Government would have been far more loth to grant independence than the Labour Government. You still get die-hard true-blue types that reckon that the worst thing Britain ever did was to dispense with the Empire. Such types don`t live in the real world, didn`t understand the movements for independence within the former colonies and have no idea how much pressure would have been brought to bear from the USA ( in particular ) to grant independence. Britains major mistake wasn`t in granting independence to the colonies but in the manner in which they imposed - often arbitrary - national borders upon the former colonies.

[Vikram]

Yes, all true Vikram, but even so a post-war Conservative Government would have been far more loth to grant independence than the Labour Government. You still get die-hard true-blue types that reckon that the worst thing Britain ever did was to dispense with the Empire. Such types don`t live in the real world, didn`t understand the movements for independence within the former colonies and have no idea how much pressure would have been brought to bear from the USA ( in particular ) to grant independence. Britains major mistake wasn`t in granting independence to the colonies but in the manner in which they imposed - often arbitrary - national borders upon the former colonies.

Truer words never spoken,Sir, especially the last line. I did meet a few middle aged gentlemen here who expressed similar sentiments.The younger generation hardly care or are aware of history.Thanks.

Best-
Vikram

[HSharief]

Grumpy, you are right about the drawing the borders thingie. I have friends from the Middle east, Eastern Europe, Africa, South Asia and Indo/Pak who say the same thing. One friend went as far as to say, and I agree that almost any "problem" anywhere in the world today can be traced back to a British SNAFU. They drew the borders not considering local religious, tribal, ethnic boundaries.

[penpusher]

A correction.The fellow wants Rs.9,00,000 for the Rossi .357 mag Its more expensive than the Colt Python as it has a shorter barrel. Use a hack saw and you can make a profit of Rs.3,00,000/-Talk about things being rotten in India.Considering how things are becoming more and more expensive by the day in India( real estate,pulses,vegetables...clean air and water)I don't think I would be able to afford to stay in India a couple of years from now.

How about a petition to the PM signed by the maximum number of people that we can get to sign to reconsider/withdraw the ban on the import of firearms and for taking steps to realise the objectives the framers of the Arms Act had set out to achieve

penpusher

[HSharief]

penpusher, I'm no expert in legislative procedures and I think we should find some and have them guide us thru the hoops on how to get this changed. There are changes made to the law all the time. Big business gets laws passed that are to their advantage all the time. We should know how to do that and follow the red tape.

From what I know/think, I'd think we should first get an entire copy of the Arms Act. Then draft a "NEW" one, find and have an MP "sponsor" it and then lobby the others to support it and get it all the way to approval. I'm not sure, if we should shoot for the stars (NO restrictions) or just be pragmatic and keep it real (sporting/self defence). The "support" can be raised by signature campaigns, affidavits, news reports, sports participation figures, crime stats, whatever. Like they say, we should "take a page" from the NRA.

I voluteer to do some research. Maybe we should form an IFG comittee that can/will pull this off. We need Gun experts, Law experts, sportsmen, Babus, Netas and everyone else who can help our cause. Worse, we will need money too, maybe the Gun and ammo companies/dealers can "sponsor" this effort.

[Vikram]

"The fellow wants Rs.9,00,000 for the Rossi .357 mag"

I am at loss at finding a suitable emoticon. This or this or this or this

With a few more lakhs,I can buy a nice flat in Hyderabad or pay off my student loan. Just curious,are there people shelling out that kind of money for what is much cheaper in international market?

Best-
Vikram

[Grumpy]

Vikram I think the obvious emoticon is !!!

[dev]

You are alone till E.T. calls home. Outside the board we are still guys who should wear jackets that have sleeves at the back (as per normal reactions from sane folk) .


Regards,

Dev

Sharief,

I'll take the third!

Mack The Knife

[penpusher]

Before somebody is mislead into believing that the prices that I have given are the prices that people normally pay or are willing to pay,I would like to point out that the prices are those demanded by a dealer here.I am very sure that he paid only a fraction of the price that he is now asking for the guns that he is selling.It did not take a lot of persuasion to drop the price of the .22 Hi standard by 20,000/- I am very sure that he did not pay more than 80,000/- for it.Still a lot of money for a 400-500$ gun.

For the .357 mag,I am certain that he did not pay more than a lakh or two.Would not be surprised if he paid as little as 50-60,000/- for at least one of them(It chambers and fires the .38 special round.It's a PB weapon.If you get caught you will go to jail and your revolver will be confiscated.Sell it to me before this happens ) He has got a AMT pistol in .30 carbine. He has indicated that he is now going to ask for a hefty amount for this as he thinks that this is the only such weapon in India.Probably the price of a new Merc


If you even talk about the possibility of the import ban being revoked , these people get a minor heart attack.I always mention that

penpusher

[mundaire]

penpusher, AFAIK PB firearms sell for a pittance compared to similar NPB firearms as getting a license for one is bloody difficult! That said the .357 is usually entered as a NPB, my 2nd cousin had picked up a .357 S&W revolver from Calcutta (now Kolkatta) in the early 90's and it was entered as a regular NPB revolver on his license. He later sold that and bought a .32 Beretta pistol as the ammunition for the .357 was a tad expensive and not as easily available.

It would seem that the .30 carbine pistol should not fetch a very high price as it should be classified as a PB round - the .30 M1 Carbine having been previously used by the military as a standard issue for officers in the field.

Having said that, people having PB handguns entered on NPB licenses is not unheard of... Corruption is everywhere...

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[penpusher]

Maundaire,

I don't think the .30 carbine was ever used by the Indian Army.The reason why the .30 M1 carbine is classified as a prohibited weapon is because of the fact that it's a semi automatic weapon.I have seen a couple of M1 carbines converted to bolt action by drilling holes in the gas chamber,being reclassified as a NP rifle.This was done at the Jabalpur depot/IOF

I was referring to the story that the dealers give to get a .357 revolver at a cheaper price.

penpusher

[mundaire]

penpusher,

The .30 M1 carbine made its way into the Indian armed forces during WWII and I believe some more came as US military aid, up to the early 1950's. These were later discontinued and declared surplus, opening the way for them to be issued to military, ex-military officers.

Due to the above, I always believed the calibre to be classified as PB, besides of course the M1 carbine (due to it's semi-auto action). If this is not the case, then I guess I stand corrected.

I was referring to the story that the dealers give to get a .357 revolver at a cheaper price.

Ooops, just reread your post...

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[Mack The Knife]

penpusher,

The M1 .30 Carbine was used by the Indian Army - by the Paras, to be precise.

Mack The Knife

[monty3006]

Mack The Knife,
Just spoke to my brother in the army. The paras of India never used the .30 M1 carbine. They always prefered the 9mm SMG. Earlier days Sten, later sterling. Nowadays they use the AKM. I'll Post a few pictures of this if I can.
Monish

[monty3006]

I think I'll always get a chance to correct good ol rusty