Help A Fan Out - Muzzle loaders made in India

[Flapapancakes]

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[Flapapancakes]

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[goodboy_mentor]

Flapapancakes, welcome to the forum. Are the muzzle loaders that are exported from India in ready to fire condition? One member of this forum from USA had stated earlier that the muzzle loaders, imported from India are not in ready to fire condition and have to be modified. This is probably because in order to avoid the cumbersome legal paper work, some muzzle loader manufacturers might be making them as non firing curios/ replicas and not as "firearms" as described in Arms Act 1959.

Yes the website of MKS gun makers claims that its guns are IOF proof tested.

You would be surprised to know that there are no privately owned riffle or handgun legal manufacturers in India. Only the government owned Indian Ordnance Factory legally manufactures rifles and handguns. Only few privately owned shotgun or muzzle loader legal manufacturers exist.

If you are looking to import rifled firearms, probably you will have to expand your search to some other countries.

[Flapapancakes]

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[mundaire]

Hi,

Currently in India the manufacture of rifled firearms of any type is a government monopoly. This may change in the near future, but I still very much doubt any of the existing muzzle loader manufacturers would take much interest in making rifled muzzle loaders (too much effort to explain the unique economics of firearm prices in India).

The two major hubs for Muzzle loader production (in India) are Udaipur and Jodhpur, both are located in the state of Rajasthan. There are many manufacturers located in these places, though I may as warn you that whether or not you like it - you may have to deal with multiple vendors! This is due to the fact that each manufacturer has strict quantity restrictions on how many firearms he may manufacture in a given year. Besides the fact that this would mean that you cannot choose to simply deal with the one manufacturer whom you consider the best, this also means that there is little incentive for them to innovate/ improve.

AFAIK, currently only the Indian Ordnance is authorised to proof test firearms of all types, though this too may change soon. Proof testing of a firearm is compulsory under law (Arms Act & Arms Rules) in India and I don't see how anyone could legally manufacture and sell and/ or export "unproved" firearms of any type.

HTH

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[goodboy_mentor]

Thank you for the kind welcome! If I may respond:

"Only a few privately owned shotgun or muzzle loader legal manufacturers exist"

Yes, this is precisely what I'm needing help with. Specifically, just who are these companies? How do I contact them to purchase product?

I would prefer them ready-to-fire, but I do have a gunsmith available to do the work. However, they still must be made historically precise and with excellent material, as they will be used for live-fire and re-enacting. My goal here is to show the American people that Indian muskets and rifles are safe, fun, and affordable. I hope to increase the trade flow between our countries as a result, but that is more a long term goal.

So in answer to that question, I will take contact information for either non-drilled or ready-to-fire manufacturers. Especially if they have rifled barrels and just need vent holes drilled.

Again, any help is greatly appreciated, I can't wait to find a business partner.

Perhaps your queries have been answered here http://www.indiansforguns.com/viewtopic ... 40#p240740

I would especially like to know why the west of India has so many more gun shops that the east. Thanks again for the welcome; I look forward to your reply.

The reasons are cultural, historical and political. If you study the history of the Indian sub continent, almost all the invasions that happened, came from the north western side of the subcontinent. Therefore to be armed and protective in nature became part and parcel of the local culture and folklore. British did a lot to destroy that culture both overtly and covertly but remnants of that culture has somehow survived. Or rather is struggling to survive due to British like or even worse covert and overt policies of the post 1947 power elite, especially based on chicanery, deceit and treacherous reasons.

[ckkalyan]

A very warm welcome to IFG Flapapancakes!

Your reason for joining IFG and posting here is perhaps, one of the most unique I have come across so far. No offence meant; I was merely admiring your resourcefulness.

I am sure you will find some helpful information from members here, that will assist you in your quest.

I wish you an enjoyable stay here and welcome again.

[Flapapancakes]

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[Flapapancakes]

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[mundaire]

I have an old copy of the India wide Arms & Ammunition dealers directory, which also has a listing of all manufacturers (including muzzle loader manufacturers). It's currently with a friend, will post the details next time I meet him.

Why are muzzle loader manufacturers located in certain parts of India only? The historical reasons are to do with how India was governed when it was a British colony. Once the British decided to disarm the entire nation (culminating in the Arms Act of 1878), they very well couldn't allow local manufacturers to continue plying their old trade. So various traditional manufacturing hubs and their artisans were "rehabilitated" by shifting them to alternate professions, for example, gunsmiths in Aligarh (Uttar Pradesh) were steered towards the manufacture of padlocks/ doorlocks. In other places like Munger (Bihar), their workshops were consolidated into one location, and they were allowed to continue manufacturing smoothbore guns under strict government supervision and only in limited quantities. The erstwhile Princely states (most of them concentrated in the western province of Rajasthan, had a little more freedom and were allowed to let their local artisans continue to manufacture sharp edged arms, smoothbore guns and muzzle loaders.

After independence the government has pretty much put a freeze on issuing new licenses for manufacture, so only those who had existing licenses are the ones carrying on with this trade. This is the real reason why you will find most of these manufacturers located in places like Rajasthan & Jammu.

Cheers!
Abhijeet

P.S. - Since both threads were essentially on the same topic, I've taken the liberty of merging the threads.

[Flapapancakes]

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[Flapapancakes]

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[Flapapancakes]

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[goodboy_mentor]

Since ownership of firearms is heavily restricted under a draconian law called Arms Act 1959 in india, the probability of finding someone who has experience dealing with these companies or their products is very low. Similarly the government employees would be equally clueless about the matter. You may try to contact from the website of the Directorate General of Foreign Trade and see if it is of any meaningful help.

[Flapapancakes]

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