Sir regarding the piston & rear guide - they both look somewhat dissatisfactory to me... Perhaps these might be the source of all that jarring... Pls comment!
Closeup pics of piston seal would be appreciated too.
What specific issues did you find with the rear spring guide & any other parts?
How much was the tolerance spacing between the piston, tube & guide?
I am told that ID tolerance is 0.5mm. ID of the spring is 15mm and OD of the guide tube is 14mm. 0.5mm tolerance each side.
Would be nice to hear about its performance post tuning as well.
AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
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main13
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
Last edited by main13 on Sat Oct 24, 2015 11:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
To every man upon this earth
Death cometh soon or late.
And how can man die better
Than facing fearful odds,
For the ashes of his fathers,
And the temples of his Gods.
Death cometh soon or late.
And how can man die better
Than facing fearful odds,
For the ashes of his fathers,
And the temples of his Gods.
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GNV
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
Then remove the three circlips on the lower trigger assembly which secure the three pins which keep the bottom and middle sears in place and remove the three pins and take out the trigger blade/bottom sear and middle sear out.
Then take the middle sear spring out.
Keep these parts in a safe place.
Trigger assembly in the receiver tube.
Added in 17 minutes 18 seconds:
Now let us disassemble the upper trigger assembly in the receiver tube.
First insert one of the rear cross pins in the hole indicated by the RED arrow.
Then tap out the pin indicated by the blue arrow. This pin is a hollow split cylinder type and is a bit tight.
When this pin is removed, remove the cross pin and all parts come out loose. Added in 2 minutes 4 seconds:
Good Night,
Be back tomorrow morning.
GNV
Added in 4 minutes 13 seconds:
just wait till I finish. I'll answer all the questions. You know I am a slow typer.
Added in 6 minutes 15 seconds:
This gun definitely needs a better spring guide.
Added in 13 minutes 8 seconds:
Spring wire dia is 3.2 mm. There are a lot more pictures to come.
GNV
Then take the middle sear spring out.
Keep these parts in a safe place.
Trigger assembly in the receiver tube.
Added in 17 minutes 18 seconds:
Now let us disassemble the upper trigger assembly in the receiver tube.
First insert one of the rear cross pins in the hole indicated by the RED arrow.
Then tap out the pin indicated by the blue arrow. This pin is a hollow split cylinder type and is a bit tight.
When this pin is removed, remove the cross pin and all parts come out loose. Added in 2 minutes 4 seconds:
Good Night,
Be back tomorrow morning.
GNV
Added in 4 minutes 13 seconds:
Dear Main,main13 wrote:Sir regarding the piston & rear guide - they both look somewhat dissatisfactory to me... Perhaps these might be the source of all that jarring... Pls comment!
Closeup pics of piston seal would be appreciated too.
What specific issues did you find with the rear spring guide & any other parts?
How much was the tolerance spacing between the piston, tube & guide?
I am told that ID tolerance is 0.5mm. ID of the spring is 15mm and OD of the guide tube is 14mm. 0.5mm tolerance each side.
Would be nice to hear about its performance post tuning as well.
just wait till I finish. I'll answer all the questions. You know I am a slow typer.
Added in 6 minutes 15 seconds:
This gun definitely needs a better spring guide.
Added in 13 minutes 8 seconds:
Dear Jai,Big Daddy wrote:That's very detailed GNV. Could you post some closeups. Pics 8 & 9 gives an impression of a thin diameter of spring.
BD
Spring wire dia is 3.2 mm. There are a lot more pictures to come.
GNV
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GNV
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
The HURRICANE's Piston.
There are 3 shallow uneven grooves on the front bearing surface of the piston. Intentional or overlooked, I don't know. If I am the manufacturer I would say they were intentional and provided to hold some moly. But I wouldn't be able to explain why they were not present on the rear bearing surface of the piston 
.
Hurricane's Piston weight is 300 gms. PH Piston weighs 245 gms.
Even though the HUR piston doesn't look so well made as the PH piston, it is working perfectly.
The spring fit in the piston is perfect. The piston rod is heat treated where the trigger steel balls engage but after heat treatment the area is not polished and rough.
Added in 11 minutes 1 second:
PH & HUR Springs and Spring Guides.
.
I found two bad parts in Hurricane. First is the piston washer. But it can be replaced using a PH piston washer. The worst is the spring guide. To replace it one need to have one custom made.
Added in 9 minutes 8 seconds:
You can see from this photo that the rear end of the spring guide is not perfectly square to the guide tube.
The rear end of the guide friction fits into the end plug as shown.
Added in 4 minutes 50 seconds: Added in 12 minutes 27 seconds:
Because of the faulty rear end of the spring guide, the spring guide, when the gun is assembled, is at an angle as shown in the photo. The spring guide tube should be parallel to the springs inside and the piston rod. Instead it is angled under spring's tension. As a result it is rubbing against the spring's inner side and the piston rod and which in turn is generating unnecessary friction and vibrations.
Also the spring guides fit in the spring is not snug like in a PH gun and pretty loose. I had seen better spring guides in pretty cheap air guns.
Added in 11 minutes 35 seconds:
This is how how I found the piston washer. I guess they made the walls of the piston washer straight instead of tapered and on finding that it increases friction they tried to remove some material from the washer with an emery paper or something. They should have gone for a new piston washer mould instead.
While what they did may work temporarily, I think it is unacceptable.
.Hurricane's Piston weight is 300 gms. PH Piston weighs 245 gms.
Even though the HUR piston doesn't look so well made as the PH piston, it is working perfectly.
The spring fit in the piston is perfect. The piston rod is heat treated where the trigger steel balls engage but after heat treatment the area is not polished and rough.
Added in 11 minutes 1 second:
PH & HUR Springs and Spring Guides.
.
I found two bad parts in Hurricane. First is the piston washer. But it can be replaced using a PH piston washer. The worst is the spring guide. To replace it one need to have one custom made.
Added in 9 minutes 8 seconds:
You can see from this photo that the rear end of the spring guide is not perfectly square to the guide tube.
The rear end of the guide friction fits into the end plug as shown.
Added in 4 minutes 50 seconds: Added in 12 minutes 27 seconds:
Because of the faulty rear end of the spring guide, the spring guide, when the gun is assembled, is at an angle as shown in the photo. The spring guide tube should be parallel to the springs inside and the piston rod. Instead it is angled under spring's tension. As a result it is rubbing against the spring's inner side and the piston rod and which in turn is generating unnecessary friction and vibrations.
Also the spring guides fit in the spring is not snug like in a PH gun and pretty loose. I had seen better spring guides in pretty cheap air guns.
Added in 11 minutes 35 seconds:
This is how how I found the piston washer. I guess they made the walls of the piston washer straight instead of tapered and on finding that it increases friction they tried to remove some material from the washer with an emery paper or something. They should have gone for a new piston washer mould instead.
While what they did may work temporarily, I think it is unacceptable.
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main13
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
Hmmm! 
I remember the AARMR techie telling me something about some cylinricity loss of 'few microns'.. Apparently this is much more than just few microns apparently...
Also, sheet metal guide is probably a really stupid cost-cutting idea IMHO.. They should've either made it synthetic or machined it.. No point in taking a tin foil & hammering it into shape..!
I had also suspected that loose guide problem.. These guys reportedly have picked .5mm tolerance which is obviously waaayyyy too much!
What in your opinion would be the ideal tolerance?
Does the same loose-fit problem occur with the piston as well?
IMHO the piston washer looks 'burnt' to me due to poor shaping??!
I remember the AARMR techie telling me something about some cylinricity loss of 'few microns'.. Apparently this is much more than just few microns apparently...
Also, sheet metal guide is probably a really stupid cost-cutting idea IMHO.. They should've either made it synthetic or machined it.. No point in taking a tin foil & hammering it into shape..!
I had also suspected that loose guide problem.. These guys reportedly have picked .5mm tolerance which is obviously waaayyyy too much!
What in your opinion would be the ideal tolerance?
Does the same loose-fit problem occur with the piston as well?
IMHO the piston washer looks 'burnt' to me due to poor shaping??!
Last edited by main13 on Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
To every man upon this earth
Death cometh soon or late.
And how can man die better
Than facing fearful odds,
For the ashes of his fathers,
And the temples of his Gods.
Death cometh soon or late.
And how can man die better
Than facing fearful odds,
For the ashes of his fathers,
And the temples of his Gods.
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GNV
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
I have a new PH piston washer, so I fitted it on the HUR piston. It fit perfectly.
Added in 27 minutes 28 seconds:
Since the piston rod's end is not smooth I tried to polished it using polishing compound and a polishing cloth with hand. But I know it needs more proper polishing. But for now this shall do.
Now to reassemble the upper trigger assembly.
Applied moly paste to all metal parts
Put every part in its place and first push one of the rear cross pins in the hole as shown in the photo.Push the pin completely in.
Added in 5 minutes 20 seconds:
Now you can tap in the split hollow pin into its hole easily. Now remove the cross pin and the upper trigger assembly is fully assembled and ready for installation.
Since the piston rod's end is not smooth I tried to polished it using polishing compound and a polishing cloth with hand. But I know it needs more proper polishing. But for now this shall do.
Now to reassemble the upper trigger assembly.
Applied moly paste to all metal parts
Put every part in its place and first push one of the rear cross pins in the hole as shown in the photo.Push the pin completely in.
Added in 5 minutes 20 seconds:
Now you can tap in the split hollow pin into its hole easily. Now remove the cross pin and the upper trigger assembly is fully assembled and ready for installation.
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Last edited by GNV on Mon Oct 26, 2015 1:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Big Daddy
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
With so many machined parts and a new trigger system (compared to local guns) and PH aside, beats me how they could have settled for such a crappy guide.
Intriguing indeed.
BD
Intriguing indeed.
BD
The early bird gets the worm, but the fact is, if the worm had woken up late, it would still be alive.
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main13
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
The general 'machining quality' of the gun is poor.. Just look at the piston & you'll know what I'm talking about... They have benefitted from gigantic specs in fundamentally correct proportions.. Yet they don't have skilled workmen to build it I believe...Big Daddy wrote:With so many machined parts and a new trigger system (compared to local guns) and PH aside, beats me how they could have settled for such a crappy guide.
Intriguing indeed.
BD
The sheet metal guide looks like a cost-cutting measure to me.. Instead they should've used nylon guide IMHO.
To every man upon this earth
Death cometh soon or late.
And how can man die better
Than facing fearful odds,
For the ashes of his fathers,
And the temples of his Gods.
Death cometh soon or late.
And how can man die better
Than facing fearful odds,
For the ashes of his fathers,
And the temples of his Gods.
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GNV
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
The machining quality of the gun is okay. Why waste time and effort on finishing the outer surface of the piston where it doesn't touch the inner walls of the receiver tube ?. Just to look nice ?. The bearing surfaces of the piston are smooth, and that is enough. Spring fit in the piston is perfect. Also piston fit in the receiver tube is nice. The inner wall of the receiver tube is smooth and needs no polishing. The upper trigger assembly is also good except for the machining of the end plug face where the rear of the spring guide fits. The bearing ball trigger is damn good and fool proof. The middle and lower trigger sears need some good polishing. Only thing missing is a safety catch. With a Diana piston washer, and spring I was wondering what this gun could do. Also a PH type polymer spring guide is an absolute necessity for this gun.
In short this gun is a tuner's delight. It offers so many options to fine tune this gun, There is nothing much one can do to a PH gun, especially the NP powered ones.
The trigger on HUR is much better than the trigger on a PH gun.
I only wish they use choked barrels. I believe in choked barrels.
And also a conventional sporting stock. Synthetic or wood doesn't matter to me.
About the trigger back pull. I am an average sized man with average sized hand and from my earlier photos you can see that when I close my hand on the pistol grip, The trigger is next to the last joint of my trigger finger where it joins my palm. And the AARMR guy claims that the the stock is designed for an average sized hand. Pretty strange.
GNV
In short this gun is a tuner's delight. It offers so many options to fine tune this gun, There is nothing much one can do to a PH gun, especially the NP powered ones.
The trigger on HUR is much better than the trigger on a PH gun.
I only wish they use choked barrels. I believe in choked barrels.
And also a conventional sporting stock. Synthetic or wood doesn't matter to me.
About the trigger back pull. I am an average sized man with average sized hand and from my earlier photos you can see that when I close my hand on the pistol grip, The trigger is next to the last joint of my trigger finger where it joins my palm. And the AARMR guy claims that the the stock is designed for an average sized hand. Pretty strange.
GNV
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main13
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
Few businessmen accept their mistakes! It takes a lot of guts...GNV wrote:
I only wish they use choked barrels. I believe in choked barrels.
And also a conventional sporting stock. Synthetic or wood doesn't matter to me.
About the trigger back pull. I am an average sized man with average sized hand and from my earlier photos you can see that when I close my hand on the pistol grip, The trigger is next to the last joint of my trigger finger where it joins my palm. And the AARMR guy claims that the the stock is designed for an average sized hand. Pretty strange.
GNV
They have promised to come out with conventional stock models in future. Hopefully that will solve your trigger problem too...
Will have a chat with them tomorrow sure.. & revert asap on our findings...
Isn't the tolerance too much between piston & guide (.5mm) ??!
To every man upon this earth
Death cometh soon or late.
And how can man die better
Than facing fearful odds,
For the ashes of his fathers,
And the temples of his Gods.
Death cometh soon or late.
And how can man die better
Than facing fearful odds,
For the ashes of his fathers,
And the temples of his Gods.
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GNV
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
It is way tooooo much, I think. The fit should be snug. The spring dia increases slightly when compressed. But still the fit is pretty poor, I think. The spring guide really sucks.
Added in 13 minutes 9 seconds:
This kind of trigger system was first used in DIANA Mod 35 I believe. Still they changed their trigger system on later models. Now I am wondering what their TO6 trigger feels like. I never seen those new guns.
JAI can you give any hints ?
GNV
Added in 13 minutes 9 seconds:
This kind of trigger system was first used in DIANA Mod 35 I believe. Still they changed their trigger system on later models. Now I am wondering what their TO6 trigger feels like. I never seen those new guns.
JAI can you give any hints ?
GNV
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A-Crossbow
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
yo bro, at least they gave use something different than the normal indian ARmain13 wrote:Few businessmen accept their mistakes! It takes a lot of guts...GNV wrote:
I only wish they use choked barrels. I believe in choked barrels.
And also a conventional sporting stock. Synthetic or wood doesn't matter to me.
About the trigger back pull. I am an average sized man with average sized hand and from my earlier photos you can see that when I close my hand on the pistol grip, The trigger is next to the last joint of my trigger finger where it joins my palm. And the AARMR guy claims that the the stock is designed for an average sized hand. Pretty strange.
GNV
They have promised to come out with conventional stock models in future. Hopefully that will solve your trigger problem too...
Will have a chat with them tomorrow sure.. & revert asap on our findings...
Isn't the tolerance too much between piston & guide (.5mm) ??!
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GNV
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
Now criticizing the bad parts is over. So let us reassemble the gun.
Since I am not fine tuning the gun and just properly lubricating it, I lightly polished the areas on the lower and middle sears where they engage by using a Dremel MotoTool and a Felt polishing tip. Applied polishing compound to the felt tip. But after assembling the gun I found that these parts require a good proper polishing because the first stage travel is still a little bit gritty and not smooth. Also I did not lubricate these areas. May be by the time some 1000 pellets are fired, they may smoothen themselves, I hope. But the second stage is clean and crisp.
First thoroughly clean and degrease ( there was no grease on any parts anyway ) the receiver tube, piston inside and out side, spring and spring guide and properly lubricate them using just the right amount of Moly. The upper trigger assembly was already lubricated and assembled.
Now let us assemble the lower trigger assembly. Apply moly to the side walls of the sears to minimise friction with the trigger housing.Insert the middle sear into position and pressing it down with your finger like shown in the photo. Align the holes in the trigger housing and the middle sear and insert the front cross pin. Press the middle sear down at the rear and insert the cross pin. Install the two larger circlips. The third circlip is smaller and for the lower sear cross pin.
Added in 34 minutes 32 seconds:
Check for smooth movement of the middle sear. Now holding the middle sear down with a small screwdriver as shown in the photo, insert the piston into the receiver tube. Move the piston forward and backward and check for smooth movement. If you close the transfer port with your finger while moving the piston you can feel the air being compressed. Align the slots in the receiver tube and piston. Insert the spring and spring guide. Holding the middle spring down insert the upper trigger assembly into the receiver tube.
Now place the action in a spring compressor and compress the spring. Align the holes and tap the rear cross pins into their position. Remove the action from the compressor.
Insert the trigger blade into its position and push the cross pin in and fit the circlip.
Screw in the trigger adjusting screws into their respective holes in the trigger housing adjust them as per your liking.
Put some moly around the barrel hinge bolt area on the breach block and fit the barrel between the jaws and fix the hinge bolt and its keeper screw in place. Put the cocking arm in its slot and fix the action in the stock.
Cock the gun and shoot few pellets.
Now the Gun is much smoother.
That's all.
Next time I strip the gun( may be after shooting some 1000 or so pellets ) I intend to replace the spring guide with a properly machined one and properly polish the trigger sears and piston rod end. And may also replace the piston washer and spring with DIANA ones if they fit in this gun.
GNV.
Since I am not fine tuning the gun and just properly lubricating it, I lightly polished the areas on the lower and middle sears where they engage by using a Dremel MotoTool and a Felt polishing tip. Applied polishing compound to the felt tip. But after assembling the gun I found that these parts require a good proper polishing because the first stage travel is still a little bit gritty and not smooth. Also I did not lubricate these areas. May be by the time some 1000 pellets are fired, they may smoothen themselves, I hope. But the second stage is clean and crisp.
First thoroughly clean and degrease ( there was no grease on any parts anyway
) the receiver tube, piston inside and out side, spring and spring guide and properly lubricate them using just the right amount of Moly. The upper trigger assembly was already lubricated and assembled.Now let us assemble the lower trigger assembly. Apply moly to the side walls of the sears to minimise friction with the trigger housing.Insert the middle sear into position and pressing it down with your finger like shown in the photo. Align the holes in the trigger housing and the middle sear and insert the front cross pin. Press the middle sear down at the rear and insert the cross pin. Install the two larger circlips. The third circlip is smaller and for the lower sear cross pin.
Added in 34 minutes 32 seconds:
Check for smooth movement of the middle sear. Now holding the middle sear down with a small screwdriver as shown in the photo, insert the piston into the receiver tube. Move the piston forward and backward and check for smooth movement. If you close the transfer port with your finger while moving the piston you can feel the air being compressed. Align the slots in the receiver tube and piston. Insert the spring and spring guide. Holding the middle spring down insert the upper trigger assembly into the receiver tube.
Now place the action in a spring compressor and compress the spring. Align the holes and tap the rear cross pins into their position. Remove the action from the compressor.
Insert the trigger blade into its position and push the cross pin in and fit the circlip.
Screw in the trigger adjusting screws into their respective holes in the trigger housing adjust them as per your liking.
Put some moly around the barrel hinge bolt area on the breach block and fit the barrel between the jaws and fix the hinge bolt and its keeper screw in place. Put the cocking arm in its slot and fix the action in the stock.
Cock the gun and shoot few pellets.
Now the Gun is much smoother.
That's all.
Next time I strip the gun( may be after shooting some 1000 or so pellets ) I intend to replace the spring guide with a properly machined one and properly polish the trigger sears and piston rod end. And may also replace the piston washer and spring with DIANA ones if they fit in this gun.
GNV.
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anoop
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
Dear GNV, thanks for the detailed review of Hurricane 15 AR. Whats your final take of this AR ? Should a person go ahead and buy it even if he cannot tune the parts of AR? Or wait for a while till company improves it. Thanks Anoop
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Big Daddy
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
Yes GNV! The T06 trigger is nothing short of AMAZING!!!. It's simply wonderful. It breaks beautifully and effortlessly. My 10 year old daughter is bang on target at 25 meters. Shows the trigger potential.GNV wrote:.....
This kind of trigger system was first used in DIANA Mod 35 I believe. Still they changed their trigger system on later models. Now I am wondering what their TO6 trigger feels like. I never seen those new guns.
JAI can you give any hints ?
GNV
In summary, it's a dream trigger.
BD
Added in 17 minutes 21 seconds:
The DIANA should be a perfect fit. A Diana seal is a perfect replacement for a PH seal. I know a couple of guys who have Diana seals in their PH. Original Diana seals cost about 600 including posting from a certain dealer as against 950 by most others. Do let me know if you need one. Will Whatsapp you the details.GNV wrote:
Next time I strip the gun( may be after shooting some 1000 or so pellets ) I intend to replace the spring guide with a properly machined one and properly polish the trigger sears and piston rod end. And may also replace the piston washer and spring with DIANA ones if they fit in this gun.
GNV.
BD
The early bird gets the worm, but the fact is, if the worm had woken up late, it would still be alive.
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kshitij
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Re: AARMR Hurricane Model 15. First Impressions. Picture Heavy
@GNV, if we were doing the Poster of the month thing, my vote would go to you and this thread. Cheers!
Lock, Stock and Barrel.