Go Indian defense!

[FPSRussia]

We might as well tuck our tails between our legs and start chanting "Chini-hindi-bhai-bhai" again.. Even if Agni-V gets operationalised, India wouldnt be able to have any kind of political, economic or offensive advantage vis-a-vis China as we are outgunned, out maneuvered and out numbered by china 10-1 in whatever way possible . Forget economic or political advantage, It wont even dare to posture with the Agni in any manner advantageous to the country in any way whatsoever when it comes to China.. So whats the point of spending thousands of crores in producing a weapons platform that does not deliver??
The way defense related scams are cropping up almost everyday in the country its a shame that this so called democracy can never seem to pull up its pants. We cant even set up a system to honestly acquire an outdated truck the likes of which could have been produced in the country by any of out truck manufacturers anyway! The way I see it, by the time even the 5th generation combat aircraft is to be inducted, some kind of scam would have been unearthed thereby delaying (if not altogether scrapping) the acquisition process by a few decades and our futile posturings against China would be a world class laugh!

By the way, that dong feng or what ever is not needed to cover whole India..It has range beyond that.

And why you are against missile development? China will never jump in a full out war with India. Because India might destroyed fully but China will also go back to stone ages.

In my opinion Wepons are built so peace can prevail..


Regards
S

[airgun_novice]

Weapons have never guaranteed peace - they exist for attack and defense. Now why would PRC *need* to jump into a full out war with India when India has become de facto raw material source and finished product market for it anyway ? And it has nibbled away at its territories and areas of influence like Burma, Nepal, Ceylone, Maldives, SE Asia, African continent, Arabs etc.? It is a permanent member of UNSC last 60+ yr - thanks to Indian leadership then, India isn't.

[Bhargav]

I feel having nukes is a good thing and why not? when everybody has it. In today's world, countries make it and keep it just to brag about it. Nobody will ever use it so it doesn't matter if china says that they can "vaporize" our cities or if now we say that we can reach major cities in china. Its just talking facts but we will never do it and they will never do it.

Advancing on defense side is essential and necessary to keep up with everybody around you or people just take you for granted.

With great power comes great responsibility, the world today knows India is responsible so its fine if it can have power. This is the reason why we don't pull international media attention when we test nukes as compared to Iran and North Korea

An armed society is a polite society - This also applies to international "societies".

[χάος]

Bravo !! Congratulations !!

Nation successfully tested a very potent Agni - V missile with 5000 KM range (however it can be more under different climatic conditions and nature of deliverance of payload under strategic deployment)

Thanks to the embargo put by the US and its allies back in 1998 after we flexed our nuclear muscle, we have made Angi - V; 80% indigenously. If there was no embargo then we would still be taking the short-cut of buying it from some other developed nations (which would have help them to increase their GDP) and helped them to blackmail us in turn. This has proven a blessing in disguise otherwise we wouldn't have even thought of manufacturing multirole fighter jet like HAL Tejas, combat choppers like HAL LCH TD - 2, INS - Vikrant, technology like 3 D camouflage, Indigenous drones like Mack The Knife and other technologies of the modern warfare like advance RADAR systems, just to name a few.

Agni-V, considered by many to be having the features of Inter-Continental Ballistic Missile (ICBM), demonstrated giant strides taken by India in its integrated missile development programme.

Only the United States, Russia, France and China possess the capability to operate an ICBM at present.

Primarily, It can deliver 1.5 tonnes of nuclear payload to any enemy target located withing China, eastern Europe, Eastern Africa, and Australia, however there are Three distinct potent capabilities of Agni - V which can be strategically utilised as and when required:
1) It can be used to take down enemy satellite,
2) Due to its potent payloading capabilities it can carry multiple missile which can be independently programmed to destroy multiple enemy targets located at different geographic locations within the enemy state; at a time,
3) Under adverse circumstances where our satellite are targetted by the enemy; it can deploy Mini & Micro satellites in the space to restore communication on ground.

Astounding .. Bravo !!!

Hope I'm able to give reasonable answers to a few burning question like the delay, quality, range etc., also to what I believe that increasing the range is not a big issue but accuracy, multiple role and load bearing capacities are of much concern. People here said that China is having 12000 KM range weaponaries but even if we consider 5000 Km range than Agni serves all the purpose to take any country back to its stone age within its range.

After 200 years of Slavery and 66 years of independence (and loads of scams and black money), I believe we are doing good.


However I think that need of interceptor missile is much more required at this moment to become even; than trying to outnumber attack missile; which is difficult because we are committed to non-proliferation. I also tally up to some extent with the believe that we need to make a greater armoury not for the war but for the peace.

Thanks & bye,
Vishal K Singh

[airgun_novice]

Bravo !! Congratulations !!

[SNIP]

Agni-V, considered by many to be having the features of Inter-Continental Ballistic Missile (ICBM), demonstrated giant strides taken by India in its integrated missile development programme.

Only the United States, Russia, France and China possess the capability to operate an ICBM at present.

Primarily, It can deliver 1.5 tonnes of nuclear payload to any enemy target located withing China, eastern Europe, Eastern Africa, and Australia, however there are Three distinct potent capabilities of Agni - V which can be strategically utilised as and when required:
1) It can be used to take down enemy satellite,

Has IND demonstrated that even on space debris ? NO

2) Due to its potent payloading capabilities it can carry multiple missile which can be independently programmed to destroy multiple enemy targets located at different geographic locations within the enemy state; at a time,

Has IND demonstrated that even on dud targets ? NO

3) Under adverse circumstances where our satellite are targetted by the enemy; it can deploy Mini & Micro satellites in the space to restore communication on ground.

Has IND demonstrated that even even though the PSLV technology is somewhat similar ? NO. Difference in satellite launching rockets and missiles is RE-ENTRY - a simple word but fraught with technological challenges.


[SNIP]

People here said that China is having 12000 KM range weaponaries but even if we consider 5000 Km range than Agni serves all the purpose to take any country back to its stone age within its range.

And the rogue nation with numerous 12000 KM capacity missiles will simply sit and allow it to be blown to stone age ?

After 200 years of Slavery and 66 years of independence (and loads of scams and black money), I believe we are doing good.

Are we really ? Ours is a country where the Prez is all set to encroach upon Defense land and has to be kicked out. PRC - nation born around the same period has done infinitely better. Why compare it with losers born/ cut out of the our/ same body ? BTW which other *nation* (not a country) has allowed itself to be cut into pieces to accommodate so called "will" of particular group of people ? The same PRC has gobbled down Tibet, the Himalayas, POK and portions of Uttranchal and Arunachal and expanded right down to the southern slopes of the Himalayas.

However I think that need of interceptor missile is much more required at this moment to become even; than trying to outnumber attack missile; which is difficult because we are committed to non-proliferation. I also tally up to some extent with the believe that we need to make a greater armoury not for the war but for the peace.

Thanks & bye,
Vishal K Singh

And how much peace has IND gathered since it's first technological leap (Aryabhat) ? There is a clear and present danger of the country going to pieces instead. What is needed is public and political will. When was the last time IND showed political will ? All the shop talk about this missile doing this and that is nothing but chai-coffee time gossip. For all I care, AGNI V can/ would/ might/ is capable of an excretion of hot chocolate - but has it so shown ? What it has shown is that it could not be launched due to inclement weather. IND can claim a range of 5000km - PRC can claim that "in reality" it's 8000KM - but even during the "test" did it fly all of 5000KM ?

Like many pointed out IND has not been able to make a decent barrel - let alone a small arm. So what is the IND public so jingoistic about ? Better to have feet planted firmly on the ground and let the wind caress the hair or the scalp (as case might be) rather than allow it entry through the ears - so to speak. As much proud an Indian I am, I still remember it took IND 1982 to have an ordinary color TV.

[arcraptor]

For the ICBM...i think 5000km is pretty decent range...but, what India should concentrate on now is its nuclear stock pile...China has nuclear bombs with yield of 500 kilotons while Indian bombs have a max yield of 25 kts (that too shrouded in controversy) and stockpile(numbers) also have no comparison India :80 to 100 and China :300(some say about,1000)...and one thing good about the DRDO is that they are working on MIRV...but, who knows how many decades it will take...anyways congrats to the DRDO guys

[Bhargav]

For the ICBM...i think 5000km is pretty decent range...but, what India should concentrate on now is its nuclear stock pile...China has nuclear bombs with yield of 500 kilotons while Indian bombs have a max yield of 25 kts (that too shrouded in controversy) and stockpile(numbers) also have no comparison India :80 to 100 and China :300(some say about,1000)...and one thing good about the DRDO is that they are working on MIRV...but, who knows how many decades it will take...anyways congrats to the DRDO guys

I totally agree on what airgun_novice says but again what I believe is, it doesn't matter if you build 80 nukes or 800, you will never use even one. So India should definitely make missiles that can reach the neighbors but not get into this pointless race of building the stockpile. Instead, India should utilize the resource in internal and external surveillance systems to counter terrorism.

But before all of this, it should manufacture enough ordinance for the police and armed forces to practice and bulletproof vests should be issued to each and every law enforcement individual.

[arcraptor]

NO country knows when the peace crumbles...no one knew long before any war . But, fate has its own games...every country tries to avoid conflict. Even ONE nuclear bomb has a great deterrence BUT in case a war breaks out in the FAR future. The country with more lethal weapons (including nuclear) will be able to save itself. And in the country with a population of 1.2 bill i think they have enough man power and money to do various projects simultaneously ,India is getting fast in the nuclear race doesn't mean it should slow down but, it should ALSO focus with the same efficiency in other projects such as counter terrorism, insurgency, weapon industries, education etc. and govt. is employing sufficient budget in other fields such as arms industry and gear automation and bulletproof vests (plz read about F-INSAS)...but, it need to pay attention to the EFFICIENCY.

[spin_drift]

Like many pointed out IND has not been able to make a decent barrel - let alone a small arm. So what is the IND public so jingoistic about ? Better to have feet planted firmly on the ground and let the wind caress the hair or the scalp (as case might be) rather than allow it entry through the ears - so to speak. As much proud an Indian I am, I still remember it took IND 1982 to have an ordinary color TV.

Forget a decent barrel, they can't even make decent .22 ammo
ICBMs are tactical weapons... what if during Chinese soldiers enter Indian territory move rapidly towards Delhi, you are not going to use an ICBM then.. what you need is soldiers with guns (with artillery support and armored divisions) to fight that scenario...
You need to be able to make good guns with ammo that actually works and keep the supply up during war

[Skyman]

Nice observations by airgun novice.He is right on all counts.No one will fire off nukes.If we go to war, soldiers will have to run around with kalashnikovs and those blasted SLR's.But then, they don't have proper food and water, forget ammo.Only is this country can things be so screwed up, where there are a billion people to protect and the government arms factory can't make a decent BARREL.

Look at the Chinese.We know they make gucci knock offs, but they reverse engineered a 4.5 G fighter from ONE plane they bought off Ukraine in the 90s, which they RETURNED after they got what they needed.Who the hell else is capable of that? Looks like we might be slaves all over again.If i was ruled by the british for 200 years, i would make DAMN sure i have enough ammo to blow anyone who tried to screw with me again.But NO. Let us buy batteries from the Americans and the Aks unorganized rebels fight with.It is good for trade when we need to grovel and plead for a AAA battery! Cops are so used to Indians cowering at the sight of a lathi they can't shoot at 50 yards!!!! And rejoice!!! The Americans have asked us to answer their phone calls and do their taxes.We are saved and our GDP is growing at 8%.Why a good 70-75% of the people can't eat enough food everyday.God bless the 1000 people who pocket all that profit.

I tell you, if there is war, it will be the ahimsa movement all over again.We have nothing much to fight with do we? Perhaps Rahul Gandhi and all those clowns can get us to boycott Chinese goods and let us hope we don't end up like Nanking in the hands of the Japs.

[varunik]

Like many pointed out IND has not been able to make a decent barrel - let alone a small arm. So what is the IND public so jingoistic about ? Better to have feet planted firmly on the ground and let the wind caress the hair or the scalp (as case might be) rather than allow it entry through the ears - so to speak. As much proud an Indian I am, I still remember it took IND 1982 to have an ordinary color TV.

Forget a decent barrel, they can't even make decent .22 ammo
ICBMs are tactical weapons... what if during Chinese soldiers enter Indian territory move rapidly towards Delhi, you are not going to use an ICBM then.. what you need is soldiers with guns (with artillery support and armored divisions) to fight that scenario...
You need to be able to make good guns with ammo that actually works and keep the supply up during war

even for that, you need roads!! if we ever go in a war against china, indian troops wont be able to mobilize quickly!!
even after BRO's begging to pass to project, the ministry has still not strengthened the roadways. leave the artillery troops, sappers wont be able to perform their jobs!

[spin_drift]

Nice observations by airgun novice.He is right on all counts.No one will fire off nukes.If we go to war, soldiers will have to run around with kalashnikovs and those blasted SLR's.But then, they don't have proper food and water, forget ammo.Only is this country can things be so screwed up, where there are a billion people to protect and the government arms factory can't make a decent BARREL.

Probably not high yield nukes, but they will for certain use tactical low yield nukes to take out strategic military targets for example vaporize a FOB being used by one of our SF units and try to quickly move in the infantry.... Also in case of India where we have a lot if insurgent groups who are being support by China and Pak, they might end up creating a lot of law and order problems on behest of China and Pak and tie up valuable resources needed to fight a respectable war.....
We really need to get our act together