WANT A RALLY FOR GUN RIGHTS!

[sa_ali]

I am in..

[denong]

hi guys,

we have to learn from anna, and how he managed to almost derail our parliamentary system of democracy. the good thing is precedence is set, the doubtful part is can we have him on our side. its high time we book ourselves ramlila maidan minus our firearms and protest non violently or starve when necessary for our rkba. well, its just an idea influenced by recent events, hopefully its taken in the right spirit.

regards

[Hammerhead]

The purpose of this forum is fight for our gun rights , we cannot fight for our gun rights simply sitting in our air conditioned offices and writing blogs but we have to go unto roads ,doing rally protesting against the government knocking doors of the government or wait for another 26/11

Bravo - That's the POWER

Educate yourself before you touch this by politically and be prepared to be knocked down few times by Media,Politicians,Police and Public

So if you can handle the pressure , sure go ahead with that

Make sure you call International Media if you doing it in Delhi

Good Luck - Haji

[goodboy_mentor]

we have to learn from anna

Democracy is the game of numbers, so let us first learn from Anna how he got the numbers on his side, so that we can also get the numbers on our side.

the doubtful part is can we have him on our side.

We can have him on our side if we are able to convince him or the people surrounding him that we can help their cause and vice versa. Also dispel their fears if any about RKBA, since the Articles 19 and 21 of Constitution of India are with RKBA. If you note recently Team Anna has also started talking about farmers issues and in return farmers have started coming to his rally in large numbers. So it is basically you scratch my back, I scratch your back kind of understanding.

starve when necessary for our rkba

I do not think there is any need for us to starve in desperation like Anna Hazare, since RKBA is already guaranteed under Articles 19 and 21 of Constitution of India. The main thing is that there is a pathetic lack of awareness about this fact among the people in general and judiciary in particular. For details about RKBA under Articles 19 and 21 you may read the following http://indiansforguns.com/viewtopic.php ... 15#p117785 or search "RKBA Article 19 21" in google, the first search result discusses the same. In my opinion before "starving" oursleves, let us first knock the doors of Hon'ble Supreme Court.

[saleem]

`also against import restriction!

[nagarifle]

we have to learn from anna

Democracy is the game of numbers, so let us first learn from Anna how he got the numbers on his side, so that we can also get the numbers on our side.

the doubtful part is can we have him on our side.

We can have him on our side if we are able to convince him or the people surrounding him that we can help their cause and vice versa. Also dispel their fears if any about RKBA, since the Articles 19 and 21 of Constitution of India are with RKBA. If you note recently Team Anna has also started talking about farmers issues and in return farmers have started coming to his rally in large numbers. So it is basically you scratch my back, I scratch your back kind of understanding.

starve when necessary for our rkba

I do not think there is any need for us to starve in desperation like Anna Hazare, since RKBA is already guaranteed under Articles 19 and 21 of Constitution of India. The main thing is that there is a pathetic lack of awareness about this fact among the people in general and judiciary in particular. For details about RKBA under Articles 19 and 21 you may read the following http://indiansforguns.com/viewtopic.php ... 15#p117785 or search "RKBA Article 19 21" in google, the first search result discusses the same. In my opinion before "starving" oursleves, let us first knock the doors of Hon'ble Supreme Court.

we need to increase our numbers by joining NAGRI. by using the local media, this can be done by giving a copy of the RKBA video made by the NARGRI[as seen in the U tube] , get the local cable sta to play them. this is something which can be done in every town/city were there are two or three like minded, the cost is not much.

[boris]

to all the senior members,

i am not being pessimistic here,but think logically-as a gun lover myself i can appreciate this courageous step you are taking but lets think for one second that if is being inspired by anna hazare's recent success then i'd say its not a good idea-why was anna's movement so successful-due to the massive support of the public,opposition,celebrities,media and indian nationals abroad.why did this support come up??because the man was fighting against corruption and 80% of the supporters without knowing the difference between lokpan and jan lokpal joined because they blindly believed that "this man can totally remove corruption" the support came because for the indian public corruption is a touchy topic and according to them is a disease for the country.tomorrow if some xyz swami,social worker were to star a similar movement on let's say terrorism,hanging afzal guru and kasab the movement would surely have huge huge support because again it is a touchy topic.

but come to our movement who supports us and our idea of RKBA - the army is happy with the stringent gun laws,the police's stand is crystal clear to all of us,majority of the public when hears that a person loves guns he is deemed to be a violent person,the media hardly cares about RKBA,there are anti-gun lobbies supported by NGO's,human right's org.,people,government's,police alike whereas there are no pro-corruption groups but there are many that are against our interest.

though i am not saying dont try but again will anyone care to support us,will the turnout and external support be even 10% of what we witnessed with the jan lokpal movement.

[goodboy_mentor]

but come to our movement who supports us and our idea of RKBA - the army is happy with the stringent gun laws,the police's stand is crystal clear to all of us,majority of the public when hears that a person loves guns he is deemed to be a violent person,the media hardly cares about RKBA,there are anti-gun lobbies supported by NGO's,human right's org.,people,government's,police alike whereas there are no pro-corruption groups but there are many that are against our interest.

I agree and find the opinion absolutely correct. The matter has to be proceeded slowly and wisely.

As I mentioned earlier, we need the numbers(increase NAGRI members). In other words let us think about all the ways by which, we can increase the numbers of gun owners and their supporters, including of those in media, NGOs, civil society, human rights groups etc. nagarifle's opinion in this matter about displaying of videos on local cable television makes sense.

Since RKBA is already guaranteed under Articles 19 and 21 of Constitution of India, at the same time we can also approach the Hon'ble Supreme Court and appraise how our fundamental rights are getting subverted and violated under the screwed up implementation of Arms Act 1959. It would certainly require a lot of homework to be done so that a well drafted, watertight case is filed by some good lawyer, especially someone who is pro RKBA.

[Pradyumna]

Boris is right , so is Goodboy-mentor. But practically before doing all those things like.. Rallying, approaching Anna party or collecting nos. in our side, it is better to go to Supreme Court. If all the IFG members could contibute just Rs.500/- for this cause, we can fight well in court after hiring the best advocate available with that kind of money. I think we have more than 6500 members here. I think it is a better option than killing time with all those discussions with no results.It will solve our RKBA & import policy. Then no reason to pay 35L for a pistol ( I do not know or want to know the pistol ) we can buy the best weapons with that kind of money for which you will be proud of.
Pradyumna

[spin_drift]

but come to our movement who supports us and our idea of RKBA - the army is happy with the stringent gun laws,the police's stand is crystal clear to all of us,majority of the public when hears that a person loves guns he is deemed to be a violent person,the media hardly cares about RKBA,there are anti-gun lobbies supported by NGO's,human right's org.,people,government's,police alike whereas there are no pro-corruption groups but there are many that are against our interest.

though i am not saying dont try but again will anyone care to support us,will the turnout and external support be even 10% of what we witnessed with the jan lokpal movement.

It does not matter… if we are able to get 300 to 400 people that would be enough to get some media coverage… and once you get that; the idea would be to get people talking about it….

During recent Lokpal fiasco the government have on many occasions talked about maintaining the supremacy and the checks and balances of the constitution and we can point out that the government is one hand talking about maintaining the supremacy and the checks and balances of the constitution and one the other hand trying to subvert the constitution and the amendments that they are proposing are elitist in nature…

What we will need to do is portray this as a civil rights movement rather than a political movement....

As per the numbers from http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/india there are around 5,500,000 licensed gun owners in India… now if you are able to portray that the government is working on taking them away .. well, you will have following…

And as far the Army and top law enforcement officials are concerned the smart ones will not poke their nose in the debate and for the not so smart ones … well when they put on the uniform they take an oath to protect and uphold the constitution and the constitution guarantees rbka .. so you can say that they are attacking the very thing that took an oath to protect… and hint towards treason… they will shut up

And throw in some religious precedents……..

[Virendra S Rathore]

Well said .. what do others have to say?
What is NAGRI's thought about it?
Can we move forward on this?
We can organize a face to face or web conference to discuss this. No issues joining in to lend a hand of help.
Rest assured, I'll appear with some pretty good banners in hand

Regards,
Virendra

[goodboy_mentor]

Did you have a word with office bearers of NAGRI to discuss what is their action plan to go ahead for RKBA?

It is my personal opinion that instead of doing rallies and making noise, we need to first have a solid ground to justify RKBA. Therefore it is better to approach Supreme Court first. Once Supreme Court utters that RKBA is guaranteed under Articles 19 and 21, the movement will have a solid reason and force to move ahead. In my opinion(subject to correction) the entire Arms Act 1959, Arms Rules 1962, notifications etc. needs to be put under the test of doctrine of strict scrutiny by court. I have tried to explain concept of strict scrutiny at http://indiansforguns.com/viewtopic.php ... 1&start=15

[spin_drift]

Well, Goodboy Mentor I agree with you about going to the Supreme Court, but not as the first step.

We need to attack this from multiple fronts and we need to test the waters that we are about to tread in by going to the Courts.. so therefore in my opinion the first we thing to do would to take out a rally to see the kind of response we get.. we explain our point of view and may be pay a couple of reporters to interview a few senior politician to where they stand and also if possible interview a couple of high court judges and supreme court judges to see what their point of view is and then accordingly approach the supreme court..

The point is how many people in India know about us.. I am guessing not many, we need to also figure out how much support we can get… and we need to have pro-rkba articles printed out in local news papers, etc … We need to make ourselves known…

[Biren]

Hi All,

Rally thing is great but then how many people on street will relate with cause? During Anna movement, where ever and what ever forum i could, tried highlighting the issue. This govermnet talks about upholding constituition, parliamentry procedure, what not and look what it did with Arms Act? No procedure was followed, public at large was kept at dark, false propoganda, this has to high lighted. Now parliamentry committe report is final, lets make people aware about its contents, chiddu's ministry's half baked truth, all what we can all think.

Rgds,
Biren

[spin_drift]

Hi All,

Rally thing is great but then how many people on street will relate with cause? During Anna movement, where ever and what ever forum i could, tried highlighting the issue. This govermnet talks about upholding constituition, parliamentry procedure, what not and look what it did with Arms Act? No procedure was followed, public at large was kept at dark, false propoganda, this has to high lighted. Now parliamentry committe report is final, lets make people aware about its contents, chiddu's ministry's half baked truth, all what we can all think.

Rgds,
Biren

How many people know whats going on.. we will need to educate people and be a bit subtle about that... you tell the people that you are getting screwed by the government.. they will listen..
here is a thought..
Take out a funeral procession of the Constitution... and people will notice and ask you "why" and if the government stops you.. it will kindda prove your point... that the government is slowly stripping the citizens of their rights....

we'll need to be creative