Dum Dum Bullets

[sonuvecv]

Dear Friends,
After wrecking hell in oslo Dum Dum bullets draw every body's ttention . I tried to serch on google but nothing satisfactory could be found ,is the hollow point bullet and dum dum bullets are same,As the hollow point bullets are available in market.
how some body can add liquid nicotin in bullets do armed forces also uses same technique
Regards
Digvijay

[timmy]

Digvijay, this gives a pretty good explanation of it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expanding_bullet

Be sure to read both the "Names" section and the "History" section. You'll find that the original "Dum Dum was a soft point bullet, and that the name got applied to expanding bullets of all types, like hollow points as well.

Remember that, when it comes to most any technical subject (and it seems especially true with firearms) that newscasters like to toss in technical terms to make their reporting sound really in-depth and expert to the regular public, but in fact, they seldom have done any research on the subject themselves, and are often in error. Almost never do they understand the root of what they are reporting, which supposed to be the basis and value of journalism -- when someone can boil down the essentials of a topic or event and educate the ordinary public.

So when the reporter doesn't get their facts straight, one must question the whole presentation they are making and wonder how many other intellectual shortcuts and lack of research is contained in their work.

But you are right in questioning what you heard and trying to get to the bottom of the matter.

-- Sat Jul 30, 2011 13:59 --

I should add that the British reaction to The Hague Convention's outlawing of expanding bullets was to develop what has become common in modern military bullets today: The .303 was developed with a bullet that is stable in flight but unstable when it strikes something. This causes the bullet to tumble or keyhole when it hits something, which also increases the size of the wound channel. Bullets developed by the Soviets and by the Americans for 5.56 also incorporate this instability.

[kuwar]

no idea

[TwoRivers]

When the British first employed the .303 cartridge with its full-jacketed round-nosed bullets in their colonial wars, they found, that even with good body hits the wound often was not immediately incapacitating. Accordingly, they conducted experiments at Dumdum arsenal in India, and came up with a bullet with drilled hollow point as the final solution, not a soft point; later outlawed for warfare by international convention. Ever since, any bullet with a hollow point, or designed to expand, has been, incorrectly, known as a "Dumdum" bullet by the press. Somehow "Dumdum"must sound more sinister than "expanding" bullet.

[sonuvecv]

Digvijay, this gives a pretty good explanation of it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expanding_bullet

Be sure to read both the "Names" section and the "History" section. You'll find that the original "Dum Dum was a soft point bullet, and that the name got applied to expanding bullets of all types, like hollow points as well.

Remember that, when it comes to most any technical subject (and it seems especially true with firearms) that newscasters like to toss in technical terms to make their reporting sound really in-depth and expert to the regular public, but in fact, they seldom have done any research on the subject themselves, and are often in error. Almost never do they understand the root of what they are reporting, which supposed to be the basis and value of journalism -- when someone can boil down the essentials of a topic or event and educate the ordinary public.

So when the reporter doesn't get their facts straight, one must question the whole presentation they are making and wonder how many other intellectual shortcuts and lack of research is contained in their work.

But you are right in questioning what you heard and trying to get to the bottom of the matter.

-- Sat Jul 30, 2011 13:59 --

I should add that the British reaction to The Hague Convention's outlawing of expanding bullets was to develop what has become common in modern military bullets today: The .303 was developed with a bullet that is stable in flight but unstable when it strikes something. This causes the bullet to tumble or keyhole when it hits something, which also increases the size of the wound channel. Bullets developed by the Soviets and by the Americans for 5.56 also incorporate this instability.

Thanx a lot sir

[timmy]

From The Lee Enfield Rifle by Major E.G.B. Reynolds, London, 1960, p 52 (a book considered to be a standard work on these British long arms):

... On the question of accuracy and lethal effect of ammunition, there was unanimous approval for a cartridge made in India known as the Dum-Dum Mark II Special. This was considered to be much superior in every respect to the normal British cartridge for the Lee-Metford rifle. The 1st Bn. The Buffs reported having fired some 40,000 rounds of Dum-Dum Special and gave high praise on its performance. Nearly all the firing they had done had been at long ranges. Volleys had been kept up consistently and, as far as could be ascertained, the results had been good. They considered the enemy did not like facing the Lee-Metford rifle and Dum-Dum ammunition. Some of the enemy were evidently using the same type of cartridge as the British, as the 2nd Bn. The Yorkshire Regiment reported a fatal casualty from a bullet of Dum-Dum Special pattern, fired from a distance of about 1,000 yards. Despite this long range, this bullet had passed through a soldier's body and lodged in the "D" of his waist-belt, after previously passing through his mess-tin and thirteen folds of the rolled great-coat of the man in front of him. The bullet was in good shape and not distorted in any way. Considerable shooting was reported to have taken place with effective results at distances up to 2,000 yards. Units engaged in operations in Sudan also submitted reports on their Lee-Metfords and ammunition, and their experiences were similar to those of the troops in India. There seems little doubt that the Lee-Metford rifle and Dum-Dum ammunition was a formidable combination, and was used with considerable confidence in these two campaigns.

The Dum-Dum bullet, named after its place of manufacture near Calcutta, India, differed from the bullet in the Mark II British cartridge in that the rounded nose was left uncovered by the cupro-nickel jacket. On impact the bullet mushroomed, and inflicted a more serious wound than the normal bullet. It appears to have had much greater stopping power than the Mark II cartridge normally used with the British rifle. The name "Dum-Dum" has often been misapplied to bullets which have been deliberately maltreated by having their noses cut off or flattened.

Here is a discussion of the development of the Mk II* (modification of the standard Mk II Full Metal Jacket service round) "Dum-Dum" bullet developed at that arsenal in India and the subsequent Mk III hollow point ammunition developed at Woolwich:

The Gun Zone -- The Origins of Dum Dum Bullets

This same subject has recently been discussed on "The High Road" forum, where these images were presented:



.303 Mk II* "Dum Dum" round



.303 Mk III Woolwich hollow point round

Here is the link to see the whole thread. Please scroll down about 2/5ths of the way down the page for where member "Mk VII" has posted some diagrams of the Mk II* Dum Dum round and the Mk III Woolwich hollow point round:

Ok whats a dum dum bullet?

[dr.jayakumar]

thanks for the information.never heard of it.

[ckkalyan]

Great information - timmy, TwoRivers. Many thanks for sharing!

[essdee1972]

Thanks for the info, guys!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dum_dum ..... basically on the area Dum-Dum, one liner reference to the bullet.

So the guy in Norway has basically used hollow points, and the press in usual wisdom referes to it as Dum-Dum?

Adding liquid nicotine: never heard of it! What would liquid nicotine do, anyway? Being shot would be equivalent of smoking a hundred cigarettes?

[ckkalyan]

Adding liquid nicotine: never heard of it! What would liquid nicotine do, anyway? Being shot would be equivalent of smoking a hundred cigarettes?

Good one essdee1972!

Thats probably the latest in Nicotine Patches albeit, it is delivered via I.V or I.M. LOL!

[spin_drift]

how some body can add liquid nicotin in bullets do armed forces also uses same technique
Regards
Digvijay

I have heard of adding mercury (Hg) although it could just be an urban legend..... Adding nicotine?? If you are adding something of that sort why not add liquid THC that would be much more humane