Quick-Draw Ka-Bar Sheath

[Grozny]

[youtube][/youtube]

Is it legal to carry a concealed Ka-Bar in India? I invented this sheath a few months ago but I am finding that most U.S. states that issue concealed carry permits only allow the carry of firearms, not knives.

So I am now looking to the international market.

[dr.jayakumar]

indian law is not clear about this.

[goodboy_mentor]

Is it legal to carry a concealed Ka-Bar in India?

There is no legal concept of concealed carry or open carry in India. If you can legally be in possession of the weapon, you can carry it the way you like it i.e. either concealed or open. I do not think there will be any legal problem selling the kind of knife as shown above in your video. Somewhat similar looking knives can be found already being sold in the Indian market.

Yes, Dr. Jayakumar is correct in saying the Indian law is not clear about edged arms. Rather the text of the Arms Act 1959 is contradicting to its own stated objective, also the bye law(Arms Rules 1962) is contradicting to the objective of the parent law(Arms Act 1959).

Arms Act 1959 is the main law that regulates all manner of arms. Whenever there is contradiction or confusion in the text of law, courts give more importance to the objectives of the legislation to infer the intent of legislators. One of the objectives of Arms Act 1959 says:
“(a) to exclude knives, spears, bows and arrows and the like from the definition of ‘arms’."

But Arms Act 1959 in Section 2 contradicts its own objective and defines sharp edged implements also as "arms" and says:

"(c) "arms" means articles of any description designed or adapted as weapons for offence or defense, and includes firearms, sharp -edged and other deadly weapons, and parts of, and machinery for manufacturing, arms, but does not include articles designed solely for domestic or agricultural uses such as a lathi or an ordinary walking stick and weapons incapable of being used otherwise than as toys or of being converted into serviceable weapons;"

Also under the Arms Rules 1962(a bye law which was created to frame the rules for implementing Arms Act 1959) we find that it says the following:

"V. Arms other than fire-arms: Sharp-edged and deadly weapons, namely: swords (including sword-stick), daggers, bayonets, spears (including lances and javelins); battle-axes, knives (including kirpans a Khukries and other such weapons with blades longer than 9" or wider than 2" other than those designed for domestic, agricultural, scientific or industrial purpose, steel baton; "Zipo" and other such weapons called "life preserves"; machinery for making arms other than category II; and any other arms which the Central Government may notify under Sec. 4."

Reference: http://www.abhijeetsingh.com/arms/india ... ule_I.html

Generally the following is accepted as "law" for sharp edged arms in India:

It is considered illegal to carry any knife which is:
1) Spring actuated
2) Button actuated
3) of blade more than the specified length(9 inches)and breadth(2 inches).

Sharp edged arms with blade length till 9" and blade width till 2" are considered as "legal". If you want to possess sharp edged arms of bigger dimensions then you need have a "license".

Exemptions:
1) Gurkhas are exempt from this limit of 9" blade length or 2" blade width for khukris. Similarly Sikhs are exempt from this limit of 9" blade length or 2" blade width for kirpans.

2) Implements designed for domestic, agricultural, scientific or industrial purpose are totally exempt from arms law. Hence it is not uncommon to find formidable looking kitchen knives, matchets(dao, dah), axes(gandasas) etc. of enormous dimensions on sale openly in markets.

[Rajat]

Is it legal to carry a concealed Ka-Bar in India?

There is no legal concept of concealed carry or open carry in India. If you can legally be in possession of the weapon, you can carry it the way you like it i.e. either concealed or open. I do not think there will be any legal problem selling the kind of knife as shown above in your video. Somewhat similar looking knives can be found already being sold in the Indian market.

I agree, you will not have a problem selling it. But this clearly cannot be said about the person carrying it. Although by law if it is less than 9" x 2" it is permissible.

Exemptions:
1) Gurkhas are exempt from this limit of 9" blade length or 2" blade width for khukris. Similarly Sikhs are exempt from this limit of 9" blade length or 2" blade width for kirpans.

Goodboy please elaborate. Where did you come up with with this?

2) Implements designed for domestic, agricultural, scientific or industrial purpose are totally exempt from arms law. Hence it is not uncommon to find formidable looking kitchen knives, matchets(dao, dah), axes(gandasas) etc. of enormous dimensions on sale openly in markets.

Yes, these are openly available but you are likely to be questioned or booked if you are found to be carrying these in the city.

[Subal das]

seems like it is sheath with belt clip. you can also bolt belt clip to most other Kabars sheaths. can you elaborate what is difference. Also in India in most regions people do not wear blazers or coats, but only shirt or Tshirt. even with long T shrirt knife in such sheath will be exposed 100s of time, unless your sheath has provision for horizontal carry.

India would be last on my list, if I will be looking for marketing of such sheath, Russia perhaps on first.

regarding if it is legal or not, there may be some notifications issued by magistrates, and in one case in Delhi such notification was enough to implicate the guy in criminal case. Even seems like the knife was planted by police itself.

[goodboy_mentor]

Goodboy please elaborate. Where did you come up with with this?

For Kirpans: The Central Government has issued a notification No. GSR-991 dated 13-7-1962 under Section 41 of the Arms Act, by that notification, the power of exemption conferred under Section 41 has been exercised by the Central Government and it has been provided in that notification that the Central Government exempts or excludes the Arms and ammunition of the description specified in column (1) of Schedule II from such of the provisions of the Arms Act and subject to such conditions as are mentioned in columns (2) and (3) respectively. In Schedule-II, Item No. 3, column 1, possession and carrying of Kripan by Sikhs has been excluded.
Article 25, it is clearly provided that the wearing and carrying of Kirpans shall be deemed to be included in the profession of the Sikh religion...................This right can only be curtailed having regard to public order and morality and health and to the other provisions of Part-III of the Constitution.
Reference Amrik Singh vs State Of Rajasthan on 18/8/1987: http://www.indiankanoon.org/doc/1009156/

For Khukris: I will have to find concerned notification. If you are able to find do let me know. Meanwhile you can also try PM to winnie_the_pooh he is very knowledgeable about Arms Act 1959 and related bye laws and it appears from his post, probably he also has a Khukri http://indiansforguns.com/viewtopic.php ... 82#p102382

You may also like to read: http://indiansforguns.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3773

[Grozny]

There is no legal concept of concealed carry or open carry in India. If you can legally be in possession of the weapon, you can carry it the way you like it i.e. either concealed or open.

That makes sense. I have always thought it stupid that American law allows people to carry a pistol openly but requires a license to carry it concealed. Half the people are scared when they see someone carrying a pistol openly and the other half are thinking about hitting him over the head and taking his expensive weapon. We would be better off like India, or even South Africa, which requires people to keep weapons concealed.

I do not think there will be any legal problem selling the kind of knife as shown above in your video. Somewhat similar looking knives can be found already being sold in the Indian market.

I am not selling the knife, just the sheath. It will work for any similar-sized knife, though it must have a straight blade like the Ka-Bar, not curved like the Gurkha.

Sharp edged arms with blade length till 9" and blade width till 2" are considered as "legal". If you want to possess sharp edged arms of bigger dimensions then you need have a "license".

Such a big knife would not fit in my sheath. If I did make a sheath that big, I do not think it would be concealable nor particularly fast to draw.

seems like it is sheath with belt clip. you can also bolt belt clip to most other Kabars sheaths. can you elaborate what is difference. Also in India in most regions people do not wear blazers or coats, but only shirt or Tshirt. even with long T shrirt knife in such sheath will be exposed 100s of time, unless your sheath has provision for horizontal carry.

There is no provision for horizontal carry. For the quick-draw feature to work, one must wear a blazer or a wind-breaker. The knife rides quite high and it is possible to conceal it under a polo shirt, but one could not draw it quickly.

My sheath has a mechanism to facilitate drawing the knife much more quickly than the sheath that is issued with the Ka-Bar. Also, because the knife rides so high, it allows one to comfortably sit on a bench. This is a problem for U.S. soldiers in Afghanistan because they cannot use their issue sheath when riding in a helicopter, so they typically just leave their knife behind on most missions.

India would be last on my list, if I will be looking for marketing of such sheath, Russia perhaps on first.

I posted this video on the English language version of Pravda. Do you have any other suggestions?

[Rajat]

Goodboy, thanks for the reply and for sharing this information!

[Subal das]

India would be last on my list, if I will be looking for marketing of such sheath, Russia perhaps on first.

I posted this video on the English language version of Pravda. Do you have any other suggestions?

here is biggest russian forum about knives, but on russian only.

http://talks.guns.ru/forumtopics/64.html

In russia almost everybody carry knives, but never send there any free samples.