Old 2nd Hand Imported vs. New IOF Guns

[MajorSKUpreti]

To Respected members of IFG

As i wish to purchase either of three, can any good member provide me information on the following,
1. metallurically and technical evaluation of all three Small Arms-.22/.32 Revolver and .32 Pistol of IOF.
2. drawbacks and positives of all these small arms
3. the future plans (improvements)and timeframe for affecting any changes in these SAs by IFB.
4.Has the IOF improved the breech block,barrel lock and metallurgical drawbacks of the .32 Pistol.

I would be indebted for a reply

shalom,

sumit

[Mack The Knife]

Hi Sumit and welcome to IFG.

My personal experience with IOF handguns is largely restricted to the .32 cal. revolver and limited at that.

By most accounts, this is the best made of the three. However, some people may differ on this point.

The only two members who could give you an authoritative reply to your question are Dr. Shirsat and TC. penpusher may also be a contender.

I would also recommend looking through the various posts in the Handgun section as you may across some useful information.

In future please post in the relavant forum.

Mack The Knife

[mehulkamdar]

Sumit,

If you're in the army, then can you not get a much better handgun subsidised by the government? Several of my friends and friends of my father received different kinds of handguns at prices that would make even people who live in the US shed tears.

If I remember right, about 3 or 4 years ago a number of Tokarevs seized by the different armed forces were given to officers at a subsidised price whereas in the past, they have been issued all kinds of handguns from Colt 1911s at Rs 150 to Webley and Scott revolvers.

Just wondering at your choice...

Welcome to the IFG and do post often.

[MajorSKUpreti]

Sumit,

If you're in the army, then can you not get a much better handgun subsidised by the government? Several of my friends and friends of my father received different kinds of handguns at prices that would make even people who live in the US shed tears.

If I remember right, about 3 or 4 years ago a number of Tokarevs seized by the different armed forces were given to officers at a subsidised price whereas in the past, they have been issued all kinds of handguns from Colt 1911s at Rs 150 to Webley and Scott revolvers.

Just wondering at your choice...

Welcome to the IFG and do post often.

Dear Mack The Knife & moderator,
I thank youfor your valuable suggestion.
1.But I would like to know how to call Dr shirsat,TC & penpusher.
2.I must tell that I was in Army and presently serving as Assistant Manager (Security) at Reserve Bank of India. The sad part about the NSP weapons given away at throw away prices by the Indian Army is the Corruption.I have applied almost 7 years back while in Army for the available small arms and I am still waiting for my TURN which I am sure will never come as those with correct connections get the weapon within 2-3 months. Anyway his a small negative for an otherwise near perfect Indian Army.
3.I would also take this opportunity to seek your guidance regaing cost of .30,.25 and .22 foreign made pistols.
Thanking You all


sumit

[Mack The Knife]

Hi Sumit,

I am sorry to hear that you are still waiting. Assuming a retired officer is still eligible to buy a small arm from the army, I suggest you send in a request every year, even after buying an imported or Indian made handgun.

As for prices of imported handguns, a lot depends on the model and condition. However, gunshops never seem to quote anything below Rs.1.5 lakhs irrespective of calibre. Normal going rate, in Bangalore, for a functional but not in pristine condition handgun is approximately Rs. 2.5 lakhs.

I do not have TC's number. No offence but I am afraid I cannot give you penpusher and Shirsat's number.

penpusher is very regular on the forum and will definitely reply when he sees this post. TC and Shirsat are not as regular, so it's best you send them a PM (Personal Message).

Mack The Knife

[Olly]

Major Sahib,
I had the same questions that u have now regarding taking a decision on which handgun to buy. U could refer to IOF postings in Nov/Dec 06.
The IOF Pistol does not command respect from a majority of old time users ! The best produce of IOF is only the MK-II Revolver .32. The .22 is some kind of aluminium alloy which I don't trust, somehow... the steel version is still in the making !! So I feel (and did) that if imported weaponry is not an option due to price etc. just go for the .32 Rev.

[penpusher]

MajorSKUpreti

I hope you have gone through the earlier posts on the same topic.There are a no. of Army officers who have waited for 6-7 years or even longer for the allotment of a firearm.However in most of these cases,it's because they have specified a particular caliber(especially a .32).The Govt. has issued instructions that the .30 Chinese pistols that have been alloted to Armed Forces officers shall not be sold to anybody(I think that it can be sold to another Army/ex-Army officer) and can only be sold after his death or transfered to his legal heirs.Perhaps you can get a .30 pistol that has been alloted to another Army officer.It's worth waiting for the pistol from Jabalpur.After all where else would you get a pistol / revolver for Rs.250/-

penpusher

[shahid]

Major Sb.

The way things are In India right now, forget about imported handguns.

The IOF made .32 revolver is a good intermediate choice. I tried it 2 years ago while on a visit to India. It is a fair and reliable revolver, and imported .32 revolver ammunition is often availabe in India. The IOF made .32 R ammunition also does not perform badly but the costs are prhobitive. It retails at Rs. 75 to 100 per piece in many markets now.

I guess the Indian Army personnel would get a preferential allotment for IOF revolvers or small arms.

The Pistol in .32 made by IOF requires much improvement on all counts. Not very elegant or reliable at the moment.

On all counts the .32 Revolver would be the best deals.

My guess is that 2nd hand ones in the Market must be commanding premium now with the limited numbers being released every week from Kanpur.

[mehulkamdar]

Sumit,

I do not know of the criteria used by the army to allot guns to servicemen, both serving and retured, but, from my great respect for soldiers, I would suggest that you reap the reward of your service to the country by buying a pistol on the subsidised prices that you are entitled to.

I have a suggestion - if there is any corruption in the process of allotments, then collect the information and send it to the Central Vigilance Commissioner in detail and also send a detailed Letter to the Editor of the most prominent newspapers, both English and the local vernacular, in your part of India. Believe me, this works very effectively and it has for me both in India as well as from the USA when I have had problems with Consular officials.

You have fought for India as a soldier when you served in the army. DO not give up a fight for your rights now that you are no longer in the army. I shall also openly call the several journalists here to contact you about your problem and write about it if they could. On your side, please keep all the copies of communication with various authorities ready.

Best wishes and I hope you get your allocation soon - the Tokarevs would be a vastlky better choice than any of the IOF stuff, BTW.

[Sakobav]

Major Sahib

"... Anyway this a small negative for an otherwise near perfect Indian Army. "
Great loyalty lets leave it there..

All the best ..

[shahid]

Not only the Army. Out of turn and prefential allotment od seized Arms & Ammunition has taken place for years in closed restricted circles in most state governments as well. Unfortunate.

[art_collector]

Major Sb,

......waiting for an allotment of pistol from the armed forces might become a shade easier......a circular last year issued prohibits sale of weapons by armed force personnels to dealers or civilians etc. The weapons in the possession of ex army officers can be held during their lifetime only. Legal heirs have to return back the weapons to the army. How would they be returned .... have no clue....but in Delhi all arms dealers have been instructed not to buy NSP weapons....the army instructions are being followed in Delhi....reallycan,'t say about other places

[MajorSKUpreti]

Dear all respondents,
I thank you all for your valuable info and suggestions.
i can comprehend the following from all the replies posted,
1..32 revolver is the best choice among all options available of IOF.My inhibition about it is the size. I need a smaller weapon as their is a constant need to carry it at this lawless laluland. Is there any option to reduce the size of this .32 IOF Revolver?

2. to fight back for the allotment-I will start the process now by writing to all bigwigs at Indain Army Headquarters.

3.I wish to tell you all that the process is secretive that even the allottment number is not revealed , no acknowledgement letter also is sent in reply to the application. so without all these applicant is only at the mercy of the allotters.

[eljefe]

Sumit,
Anyways, you are going to be standing in queue till the cows come home for a handgun allotted by the Army HQ...
Since it is a personal carry weapon, why decrease your odds by asking for a NP bore 32 or 30 Tok? Major demand , you'll have to wait for a couple of more years...
Ask for P bore 45 or a 9mm . It can easily be carried under a shirt-in an INSIDE THE WAISTBAND HOLSTER or a blazer , and far effective manstopper wrt 32.
I'm guessing you wont be doing major weekend target shooting with the 32 or 30 Tok either, once the intial zero/ familiarisation is complete.So then...
Best
Axx

PS-Dont let my personal preference for a 45 influence your decision-me? I love the 1911 and the 230 gr bullets;)

[shahid]

The IOF .32 is not a very big arm to carry. Specially in winter clothing. It can easily go unnoticed in a trouser belt holster or in a sholder holster.