What do you like better in field/hunting ,O/U or SxS?

[TwoRivers]

For those who think that you "aim" a shotgun. Before you join in the discussion, try "pointing" the shotgun.

[Bespoke]

Maybe some should pick up a dictionary and see what "aim" means to "aim" is to point at something.
Everyone in world do not speak American English.
One of the most extensive works on Double shotguns is "The Modern Shotgun" in 3 volumes by Major Sir Gerald Burrard and he never used term "pointing" but always uses "aim".

[shooter50]

As far as hunting in this country used to go- rabbit, partridge, grouse, ducks and other small game I have never seen anyone come on an hunt armed with an O/U. The shooters tell me it is the preferred weapon for Trap and Skeet but in the field I guess the S X S rules. It is more a question of tradition rather than what is better, the difference is always so slight that one tends to prefer tradition. That is probably the reason why old S X S double rifles and heavy calibers on prewar Mauser actions are so much in demand on hunts in Africa.

[peterdk]

That is probably the reason why old S X S double rifles and heavy calibers on prewar Mauser actions are so much in demand on hunts in Africa.

well also because of the cool factor, which is very high when walking around with a double over your shoulder in africa

best

peter

[shooter]

First of all i welcome peter. please do post an introduction in the appropriate section.

secondly a very interesting view.

I do agree you know what you are talking about and would like to learn from you. I like the intuitive way of shooting. The old 'churchill way' of shooting.

I however do agree with vikram that in most of driven hunts, o/u dominate.

The ISU skeet is a fast way of shooting more where one doesnt have much time to swing through. In fact one has to pretty much have to stay ahead of the bird.

But o/u dominate the skeet scene. Please bear in mind. skeet is mostly about crossers/quartering birds.

Most of good brands now have light o/u game guns with straight stocks. The nearest one comes to game shooting is sporting clays /fitasc and that too is dominated by o/u.

But yes I would like to shoot a nice double sidelock on a game shoot.

I shoot the following:

o/u for competition
semi for wildfowling on the marches
10 bore for high geese
sxs for shooting rhode island reds.

but ultimately since i pay through my nose for it, i usually take the gun i shoot most accurately with , my o/u if i cant afford to miss.

[peterdk]

shooter thank you for the welcome

i try to be modest in most of my dealings in life, and if people want to know more about me, i ask them to read terry wielands book dangerous rifles second edition, some of my work is mentioned on page 60-61.

seeing that you are in london, we could maybe get together at one point, maybe on the A1 shooting field, and i would love to help you with your shooting with whatever means i have. please send me your contact info via PM and i will make sure to call you next i am in london(i am there several times a year)
or we could get together in copenhagen as we have a very good clay range there.

best

peter

[shooter]

A1 shooting!!!
are u kidding me!

thats my home ground.

[peterdk]

no kidding

i like it too, although i hate the high tower with the snipe clays

lets see if we can figure something out in the spring time, as i am now looking out at 3" snow and -3 degrees

best

peter

[sa_ali]

no kidding

Dammit, i feel so jealous when you all talk like this, When can we njoi the same thing here in delhi

Shooter lucky you, do share when you rendezvous with Peter.

-- Mon Nov 29, 2010 22:10 --

This debate is always there, SxS or O/U.
With the explanation given by you peter, how come there is no international shooter shooting any shooting event with high grade SxS.
I am not questioning your inputs, it just reignited the same question in me. I saw my own grandfather shoot trap with his H&H Paradox with same ease any any top shooter, he was never comfortable with O/U. I preferred the vision plane he got in SxS.
I always wonder why O/U, rather on range a person with SxS is center of jokes.

[Steve007]

no kidding

Dammit, i feel so jealous when you all talk like this, When can we njoi the same thing here in delhi

Shooter lucky you, do share when you rendezvous with Peter.

When I was in England, I was shocked to find that you needed a license to purchase ammo!

[/quote]

Steve come to NJ and NYC you need state/city specific license. NJ wont even sell ammo to NY Law enforcement folks

[captrakshitsharma]

Wow i've been greatly educated and widened my horizons with all your posts...would love to hear more on running target(rabbit) or a sideways (pheasant/pigeon)flying target....

[TwoRivers]

Having done my fair share of hunting and sport shooting, though far from considering myself an "expert", I'll say this: Personal choice. Whichever fits you better, whichever you shoot with the better, that's the better gun.

Granted, in sport shooting, the O/U rules. Likewise, the SxS in the heavy rifle, but it's because of its shallower opening angle that it is (to be) preferred. And it rests easier on the shoulder. And don't forget the look!

I started hunting with a SxS, but later got a Merkel O/U, out of curiosity (and because I could), liked it , hunted with it, and shot trap and skeet with it, until steel shot became mandatory for waterfowl. On trap it did fine, on skeet not so well with its modified and full chokes. Switching to a Winchester M59 skeet gun, gained me 3-4 birds. Later on, I took a Winchester M97 duck hunting one day because it was pouring rain, and I wanted that third shot because of the locality I was hunting. Ended upt feathering every bird on the right side on jump shots, and put that gun away again. Then later, after I had moved to Alaska, I picked it up again, a "better" rainy weather and canoe gun than the Merkel, decided it might feel better without the pistol grip, and rasped that off. And birds started dropping from the sky. But we are still talking single sight plane. The most amazing skeet shooter I ever witnessed, absolutely powdering 49 out of fifty, with the remaining one well broken, shot a Winchester M21 SxS, with 32" barrels, choked full/full. He was a duck hunter of local repute, and, could he ever shoot.

The modern, largely machine-made, O/U probably gives you more gun for the money than a SxS of equal quality. And it's the "in" thing for sport shooting. The top shooters may well tell you that they gain a few birds with an O/U, but did they try a pimped and fitted SXS to compare with their O/U? The live pigeon shooters of old seemed to do quite well with their SxSs.

Unless we can come up with a shotgunning robot, totally free of human prejudices and opinions, or totally similar humans, the question is not likely to be settled. In my humble (or not so) opinion, the claim that one or the other is better for crossing or straight shots, is pretty much hog wash. You, or I, may well do better for a particular shot with one or the other, but the guns we compare are most likely not expertly fitted to us. And, consequently they may fit you better for a particular shot. And who is to say, that we as individuals are equally proficient at different angle shots?

Every army tests every possible rifle. And invariably, their own turns out to be the best. Why?, being trained with, and familiar with their own, the testers have a built in bias. The more experience they have with their own weapon, the greater that bias is going to be. Back to that robot......

[shooter]

And it's the "in" thing for sport shooting. The top shooters may well tell you that they gain a few birds with an O/U, but did they try a pimped and fitted SXS to compare with their O/U? The live pigeon shooters of old seemed to do quite well with their SxSs.

Saeed shot with a bespoke best sidelock sXs and reached the finals (top 6) of olympic skeet world championships. but in the end, the o/u's won. he placed 6th(last) in the finals. but what that also means that with a best sxs one can be no 6 in the world.

Please also note that NASSA and olympic skeet differ in the speed of clays and the gun down position and the random delay. (olympic being more difficult).

I like this debate. even the most recent books on shooting, the ones written in the 21 century have the first chapter dedicated to this debate. (but they all reach the conclusion, o/u is better for competition).

[captrakshitsharma]

Guys, i never thought when i posted this topic that it will be of so much interest to so many people and get me so many point of views......
So what was saeed shooting with are you associated with him

[shooter]

Saeed was shooting a sxs best sidelock with a very high rib.
I am not associated with a great shooter like him but do try to watch the world cups.

Another one VERY important thing no one seems to have mentioned is the muzzle flip.
Very important in the competition. less in o/u.
Makes a lot of difference esp in the DT and station 4 in ISU skeet.