Man-eater

[grewal]

The very idea of tagging and auctioning the opportunity to kill a tiger is a sick idea . I don't know why some members here on this forum are always giving ideas of promoting wildlife eradication . I want to ask the member that has he ever worked to preserve the wildlife around himself, has he ever planted trees so that they can grow and make the life of the future generation possible, They always try to put forward sick ideas rather than give a sensible solution. Its not an opportunity of going on space tourism where a billionaire person will pay fortune just to have an experience of being in space . Here we are talking of an animal which is so majestic that I want my coming generation should also be able to see , otherwise in the next Jurassic park sequel we will see tigers instead of dinosaurs cause there wont be any alive tiger left in this world. Its like when medico people in the zoo come to a conclusion that a certain old tiger wont live long and this opportunity can be used to generate money by giving such an opportunity to a person who wants to pay for that kill . And an explanation that otherwise also that poor chap was going to die in few days , so why not make money and make this occasion grand event and use it as a wildlife conservation opportunity .

Whereas killing a man-eater tiger , it depends on the circumstances. No two events of shooting a man-eater can be compared. I think at the end of the day saving human lives should be the priority.

[m24]

Gents, this topic is digressing from its main point. It was about man-eating animals (tiger, lions and the lot). Let's stick with that, please.

Vikram, till I have all the facts w.r.t Billy Arjan Singh and his project, I can't say whether that project was quixotic. But I give the guy and his team the credit for getting into something like it.

Shooter: All points accepted except one or two. Don't see the logic of killing one-two tigers to save the rest.

Winnie: IMHO, money was never the problem w.r.t tiger conservation. Budget 2010-11 has an allotment of 968 crores for the ministry to get its ball rolling. I guess the problem lies in finding the right people who have the passion to do something about it (within the departments). And they be given the freedom to set things right. The babus who are already there don't want to do anything about it.

I understand the feelings of the families who have lost their loved one to a man-eater, though as winnie rightly said, I personally haven't.

And yet, my mind remains in duality....

Regards

[Vikram]

M24,

I did read his books and literature about him.It is extremely dependent on the person in question and there are just too many variables involved without exactly clear outcomes.How repeatable his methods are is very much unproven and speculative at best.I understand your reluctance to make a conclusion based on my post.I do not expect anyone to.

Grewal,

You can make all your points without using uncivil language even if the topic is close to your heart and you are passionate about it.I think we had a discussion about it.

Anthropomorphising nature is not very helpful to understand nature.Beauty,majesty- ugly,hideous,blood thirsty all are human concepts and that is not how nature operates.You want to save the species and it takes a slight fraction of individual examples,so be it if it is the most practicable and cost-effective method of conservation.It is not about eradication.It is about conservation.I strongly suggest to do some reading instead of gushing forth with our feelings.It neither helps the discussion nor certainly the tiger.

This website is replete with posts about hunting as an effective tool of conservation.

Best-
Vikram

[prashantsingh]

Talking about the grand old man "Billy" Arjan Singh.
I wrote this "Letter to the editor" for a wildlife magazine on Billy's passing away.
Thought I will share it with the IFG members.



BILLY ARJAN SINGH

15-08-1917 to 01-01-2010

The first book I read on wildlife as a young teenager was "Born Free" by Joy Adamson. The story of an orphaned lioness cub called "Elsa", raised by humans and finally reintroduced into the wild.
For years I looked for an Indian Hero who would come up with something similar.
Finally, on my sixteenth birthday I was gifted a book called "Tara-A Tigress" by my grandfather.What made this book so special was that it had been personally autographed by the author Billy Arjan Singh. The book was my prized childhood possession and I would often show it around and brag about it to my friends. It was very well written and had some amazing photographs of Tara in her different stages of growth and development. From an adorable and playful cub bought from a London Zoo to a majestic adult tigress.I was so captivated by the book that I would often browse through it and marvel over the contents.
All good things come to an end. One day my "Best Friend" in school borrowed the book "for a few days" and I never saw it again. It is not surprising that this best friend soon turned into my sworn enemy.
"Billy" was born in Gorakhpur (East U.P.) and belonged to the Royal family of Kapurthala. After a short carrier in the army, he perchased a farm in Lakhimpur Kheri.
Few years later he bought a 50 acre estate near Dudhwa and named it "Tiger Heaven".
Like Jim Corbett he was a hunter who turned conservationist and remained a bachelor all his life. He will always be remembered for his work in reintroducing big cats into the wild.
His contribution in influencing Mrs Indira Gandhi to transform Dudhwa into a protected National Park is surely his greatest achievement.
Many scholars believe that Billy's reintroduction programmes were a disaster. It was claimed that most of these big cats (Leopards and a tigress) failed to thrive in the wild. Having grown up amongst humans these animals had no fear of man. It is said that they turned maneaters and were terminated / poisoned by villagers sharing the same habitat.
It was also found that "Tara" was not a pure bred Royal Bengal Tigress. Born out of captive breeding, she had Siberian Genes as well. By reintroducing Tara into the wild , Billy had indirectly polluted the "Gene Pool" of the Dudhwa tigers.
Whatever the experts may think. For a layman and a wildlife enthusiast like me Billy was a super star.
His life was dedicated for saving the tiger and his habitat.
With his death , our nation has lost a hardcore wildlife conservationist. In my eyes, and in the eyes of most nature lovers, he will always remain the real "Tiger of Dudhwa". The braveheart who fought fearlessly till the last days of his life to defend every tree and every animal living under it.
India today needs a hundred such Billy Arjan Singhs to bring back our 1500 odd tigers in the wild from the brink of extinction.


Prashant Singh

[shooter]

This website is replete with posts about hunting as an effective tool of conservation.

Please read the posts. there are quite a few. If not posts here, there are many elsewhere on the internet etc. Saying that it is easy to sonserve a species if its worth more alive than dead and vice versa has been quoted by a famous wildlife conservation expert and has been mentioned twice before in IFG and so im not going into details. I dont see why that doesnt make sense to you? If you dont agree with option d in my post then please read option e and act accordingly.

Please note that we are talking about methods used successfullly elsewhere rather than just making up theoritical stuff.

I dont enjoy the fact that tigers are dying. I dont think anyone here has made more posts lamenting the loss of wildlife.
If hunting is made legal, i am sure i wont be able to afford it so i wont gain anything. I am not even sure if thatas the right way hence asking for ideas.

I hope for a change the ideas are other than the following:
The govt. is corrupt
Nothing can be done
Babus wont let it be done
Stop poaching and illegal trade but it cant be done because of corruption
Stop people from entering the forest.

. I want to ask the member that has he ever worked to preserve the wildlife around himself, has he ever planted trees so that they can grow and make the life of the future generation possible, They always try to put forward sick ideas rather than give a sensible solution.

I have tried to work, yes. planted trees, yes. Visited nationalparks and thereby generated income, yes. Pay money to organisations for conservation, yes. Saved water, yes. Save wood etc, yes. Saved petrol, yes. Educating people, yes. Felt hopeless while doing so, yes. Still not given up hope, yes. Started a poll asking others what they have done, yes. Saddened to see no one replied and hence concluded no one else is doing anything, yes.

Feeling sorry for making you feel sick, yes. Continue to write such posts, yes.

[prashantsingh]

Though I do not believe in "Billy's" reintroduction programme, I do feel that his intention was pure .
He was a true animal lover. His last wish was that his ashes be buried amongst the graves of his pets (in Tiger Heaven).

In protected game reserves in Africa one could probably achieve some success due to minimal human interference . But I do not see much hope in an overpopulated nation like India where Forests and Environment take a back seat.

Like "Billy" always said "If only they (tigers) could Vote. They would have a better future".

[m24]

Like "Billy" always said "If only they (tigers) could Vote. They would have a better future".

Hey chief, we have that right, and look where it got us!!

But still, what I believe is that the idea of Billy should not given up.

Regards

[hvj1]

Just Imagine

Thousands of space ships land on earth. Spacelings emerge and start zapping humans, just with their thoughts! Spacelings communicate at a frequency not known to humans. Spacelings colonise the planet but some of them just love zapping humans.Spacelings also made "trophies" out of the largest and tallest "humans" they "zapped". Few humans left, are allowed to live in colonies. Sometimes spacelings enter such colonies and humans gang up on them and manage to kill them. Spacelings retaliate and wipe out entire colonies. Even fewer humans remain. Spacelings decide, since they are the superior beings, their lives are more important and valuable than humans, hence a few will be preserved for the future the rest are wiped out. It is also planned by spacelings, that if in future more humans are required, with their cell technology, they can always grow a few humans for future consumption.
How do the remaining humans feel? If you can feel that, then imagine how the tigers feel?

[fantumfan2003]

hvj1

What a thought....

Paji tussi top ho top.........



M.

[prashantsingh]

Very well written hvj 1 .

I like the way (simple and very effective) you put across your opinion.

You perhaps forgot to mention these Spacelings also made "trophies" out of the largest and tallest "humans" they "zapped".

[kanwar76]

The very idea of tagging and auctioning the opportunity to kill a tiger is a sick idea . I don't know why some members here on this forum are always giving ideas of promoting wildlife eradication . I want to ask the member that has he ever worked to preserve the wildlife around himself, has he ever planted trees so that they can grow and make the life of the future generation possible, They always try to put forward sick ideas rather than give a sensible solution. Its not an opportunity of going on space tourism where a billionaire person will pay fortune just to have an experience of being in space . Here we are talking of an animal which is so majestic that I want my coming generation should also be able to see , otherwise in the next Jurassic park sequel we will see tigers instead of dinosaurs cause there wont be any alive tiger left in this world. Its like when medico people in the zoo come to a conclusion that a certain old tiger wont live long and this opportunity can be used to generate money by giving such an opportunity to a person who wants to pay for that kill . And an explanation that otherwise also that poor chap was going to die in few days , so why not make money and make this occasion grand event and use it as a wildlife conservation opportunity .

Whereas killing a man-eater tiger , it depends on the circumstances. No two events of shooting a man-eater can be compared. I think at the end of the day saving human lives should be the priority.

Grewal,

I don't know whom are you adressing in your post but still, Is having a cactus in my balcony good enough

Just Imagine

Thousands of space ships land on earth. Spacelings emerge and start zapping humans, just with their thoughts! Spacelings communicate at a frequency not known to humans. Spacelings colonise the planet but some of them just love zapping humans. Few humans left, are allowed to live in colonies. Sometimes spacelings enter such colonies and humans gang up on them and manage to kill them. Spacelings retaliate and wipe out entire colonies. Even fewer humans remain. Spacelings decide, since they are the superior beings, their lives are more important and valuable than humans, hence a few will be preserved for the future the rest are wiped out. It is also planned by spacelings, that if in future more humans are required, with their cell technology, they can always grow a few humans for future consumption.
How do the remaining humans feel? If you can feel that, then imagine how the tigers feel?

Why not if they got better guns and power than us

Sadly its a Jungle out there Hvj1 and feelings don't matter in a Jungle.

-Inder

[Vikram]

Just Imagine

Thousands of space ships land on earth. Spacelings emerge and start zapping humans, just with their thoughts! Spacelings communicate at a frequency not known to humans. Spacelings colonise the planet but some of them just love zapping humans. Few humans left, are allowed to live in colonies. Sometimes spacelings enter such colonies and humans gang up on them and manage to kill them. Spacelings retaliate and wipe out entire colonies. Even fewer humans remain. Spacelings decide, since they are the superior beings, their lives are more important and valuable than humans, hence a few will be preserved for the future the rest are wiped out. It is also planned by spacelings, that if in future more humans are required, with their cell technology, they can always grow a few humans for future consumption.
How do the remaining humans feel? If you can feel that, then imagine how the tigers feel?

HVJ1, I did not know that you are also a Tim Burton's fan. I loved 'Mars Attacks' Now, lets examine the situation you envisaged.

In the case of an alien invasions, we will first try your method.Talk sense to them.Like this.

[youtube][/youtube]

If the end result of said endeavour is the same as in the motion film extract, we will use this method against which there is no defence for the spacelings.
[youtube][/youtube]

Sorted.



Best-
Vikram

[grewal]

At the end of the day everyone wants to see the tigers flourish . Its my humble request that we should not propose different ways of hunting , instead we should be creative regarding conservation.

[shooter]

Hunting can also be a part of conservation.
Do you know that when you hunt in Africa, you get a certificate of conservation.

[grewal]

Hunting can also be a part of conservation.
Do you know that when you hunt in Africa, you get a certificate of conservation.

lo kar lo baat saree raat ramain parhee or who puchtay hai kay sita kaun thee. Yaar MBA kar loo certificate mil jayaga.