Buying an airrifle in UK..

[hamiclar01]

it's just that, being law abiding guys, they will not tune a gun into an FAC weapon until you show them your FAC. The other option, shopping around in India...well, that could take forever and still not work, no?

What's so bad about the 350? Is it not a well made rifle? Of course, it's not a Theoben, but we're living in the real world here, aren't we?

para one: you're missing the point. you need an FAC ticket to USE a PCP/Springer tuned to FAC levels in the U.K., not to commission a gunsmith to tune one. i will not elaborate further, except to say there is nothing illegal about the process. it is rdhillon's cause and he can follow this up with me or the others if he wants to.

para two: ai has echoed my sentiments perfectly

no malice to you or anyone. the opportunities with airguns in the u.k. ,even within it's stringent laws, are much more numerous than in india. what can be done and cannot is best determined by actually going around and speaking to the people in the business, not armchairs discussions in a forum. my experience with u.k. gunsmiths found them to be a genial, helpful and clean bunch who are keen to give you the best, and are always ready with suggestions.

[ai]

para one: you're missing the point. you need an FAC ticket to USE a PCP/Springer tuned to FAC levels in the U.K., not to commission a gunsmith to tune one. i will not elaborate further, except to say there is nothing illegal about the process. it is rdhillon's cause and he can follow this up with me or the others if he wants to.

My knowledge is bound to be far lesser than yours or anyone based in UK, but I'm not so sure about this point's validity from Dhillon's point of view. Will the authorities not question/investigate a tune up by a gunsmith and hold him responsible? Each FAC airgun is registered AFAIK. Possesion, not just use, of an FAC airgun is certainly illegal. Someone owning an airgun can tune it up as simply as replacing a spring in a springer. A gunsmith tuning an airgun up can possibly deny doing so if asked. But what is the legal stand on conversions?

In any case, unless Dhillon has a FACertificate, he should not even think about possessing a tuned up airgun within UK. Secondly, if he acquires a 12FtLbs airgun that can be tuned up later, he should not get that done in UK, as between the time of tune up and exit from UK, he will be responsible. The tune up, if any, should ONLY be done when back in India.

As for increasing power, tuning up or altering the internals is not the only way. Increasing the barrel length is a simple method!

[eternalme]

hamiclar01,
You can please revert the specific armchair comment for now, its not virtuous of someone throwing this kind of remarks in a virtual forum.
No-one is being a couch potato here , we are all sharing what we know and none is a better judge then the information requester, so please practice little self restrain.

Dhillon,
please be aware you can be thrown behind the bar in no time if you are found doing something funny in main land UK(Remember, you are in foreign land its not "Jugaad India" where "sab kucch chaltaa hai") .British are too Hippocratic when it comes to "by the book" , no-one will be able to help you out despite being an expert in conversion etc.

This is my humble opinion only, all the best anyways.

[kanwar76]

Dhillon,
please be aware you can be thrown behind the bar in no time if you are found doing something funny in main land UK(Remember, you are in foreign land its not "Jugaad India" where "sab kucch chaltaa hai") .British are too Hippocratic when it comes to "by the book" , no-one will be able to help you out despite being an expert in conversion etc.

This is my humble opinion only, all the best anyways.

I am sure thread starter knows about the laws in UK thats why he wrote "n I would prefer buying something that I could use here n then power it up once it reaches India by probably changing the main spring etc..."
Regards,"

On the topic:
If you ask me, I will buy a second hand Springer (TX200/AA Prosport or HW77/97 if .177 or Diana 52, HW 80 if .22) from airgunbbs.com. Send it to Steve Pope at Venom, ask him to tune it at FAC levels and send the internals to INDIA by post and carry the rifle myself with 12FT/LBS internals to INDIA. I don't think by doing this either you or Steve is breaking any laws in UK. You can easily change the internals while in INDIA and have a FAC rifle. Steve will also send the instructions along with the internals or you can buy venom DIY kits from airgunbuyers.com also.

I have bought FAC venom kits from UK and they were sent to me by post in INDIA.

HTH

-Inder

[eternalme]

Kanwar76,

I am sure thread starter knows about the laws in UK thats why he wrote ....
.

Please read my second post immediately following the fist post, I am aware that the original poster is aware of the UK laws, thanks for pointing out though.

My previous post was in related to the turn this topic has taken since then,i.e, converting an airgun to FAC power levels in mainland UK.

UK suppliers will happily sell FAC power level material outside UK as the UK arms legislation doesn't apply out of UK.

Thanks .

[mundaire]

From a careful reading of Hami's posts it is clear his comment regarding a PCP tune up are vis-a-vis the thread starters desire to get his air-gun tuned up when he decides to returns to India. UK gunsmiths will happily tune up a PCP for the export market as it does not break any UK laws, they will without exception not do so for a domestic customer unless he has a valid FAC permit.

Am sure Hami can clarify this point himself... though it is quite evident if one goes through the entire thread and how this discussion has developed and the context in which the PCP tune up response was posted.

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[hamiclar01]

hamiclar01,
You can please revert the specific armchair comment for now, its not virtuous of someone throwing this kind of remarks in a virtual forum.
No-one is being a couch potato here , we are all sharing what we know and none is a better judge then the information requester, so please practice little self restrain.

Dhillon,
please be aware you can be thrown behind the bar in no time if you are found doing something funny in main land UK(Remember, you are in foreign land its not "Jugaad India" where "sab kucch chaltaa hai") .British are too Hippocratic when it comes to "by the book" , no-one will be able to help you out despite being an expert in conversion etc.

This is my humble opinion only, all the best anyways.

as i have already said, i bear no malice. so i'm sorry if any of my comments appear to be reeking of such.

inder has said exactly what i have been hinting at. while it will be impractical to assume buying a full blown FAC airgun in the u.k., it is perfectly legal , via the methods he has detailed, to end up with one in india. while it is simple with springers, with most companies happily shipping springs to india, it is more complicated with pcps. hence the suggestion to get in touch with the locals and find out what can be done.

if you read again, i have never recommended buying a FAC air rifle in the u.k. all along, simply because it is not possible without a ticket.

[hamiclar01]

My previous post was in related to the turn this topic has taken since then,i.e, converting an airgun to FAC power levels in mainland UK.

no it hasn't. please don't jump to conclusions. i have been talking about customising FAC parts to convert sub FAC airguns bought in the u.k.

errr, i've just spotted abhijeet's post. yup, that's what i've been trying to say.

[lazybones]

RD: there might be a fly in the ointment. I vaguely recollect reading somewhere that non FAC air rifles in the UK are being permanently hobbled to make sure they can't be upgraded to FAC standards - something to do with enlarging the size of the air transfer port. I'll try to locate the article for you, if I still have it.
Do check this out before buying.

Ashok

[sol]

That's what I was trying to convey earlier, lazybones; that the uk guns are probably hobbled (exactly the right word:) to prevent use at FAC levels. It would be a shame to spend money on parts and tuning, only to find the barrel bends on cocking or something fundamental breaks or bursts on filling/firing...

[eternalme]

RD
Check the UK manufacturers like Day state,Air arms etc, they have options for upgrading a gun to FAC for export, moreover they are very advanced guns so back home they will be more of a proud possession.

Regards

[ai]

Eternalme,

The option is not for UPGRADES. FAC is a seperate product line for similar guns. All makes have that segmentation. 'Export' means just that- these models will be exported directly without Dhillon getting to lay his hands on them within UK. Daystate electronically regulated guns cannot be tampered with without removing the electronic regulator, which means removing it's heart that a Daystate gun is built around! Dhillon should not even consider Daystate electronic ones. For other valve regulated ones, tampering is getting increasingly difficult. Unregulated ones are the ones that Dhillon could look at.

I'm waiting for Dhillon do do his bit of the legwork and narrow down to a couple of models he might want (if PCPs) before helping him hit the bullseye.

[R-Dhillon]

I spoke to a few people including the guys at Blackpool. They told me that I should buy a HW-97\77 and they would post the internals to my address in India. Now, does a HW-97\77 give 20ftlbs? Thats what they told me. I wouldnt mind buying one in .177 cal if it does that much energy. A 7 grain pellet would be travelling at 1000+fps if my calculations are correct. Mr. Amitoz, how good are the OX accelerator mainsprings. They are suppose to increase power by 40% than conventional main springs. Any info?
Regards,
R.Dhillon.

[mundaire]

I spoke to a few people including the guys at Blackpool. They told me that I should buy a HW-97\77 and they would post the internals to my address in India. Now, does a HW-97\77 give 20ftlbs? Thats what they told me. I wouldnt mind buying one in .177 cal if it does that much energy. A 7 grain pellet would be travelling at 1000+fps if my calculations are correct. Mr. Amitoz, how good are the OX accelerator mainsprings. They are suppose to increase power by 40% than conventional main springs. Any info?
Regards,
R.Dhillon.

I would suggest that you not sacrifice accuracy for pure power when "tuning up" your air-rifle. The idea should be to tune up your air-rifle to an optimum power level and also to improve the smoothness, a FAC rated V-Mach kit should fit the bill nicely... they are relatively pricey but having shot a V-Mach/ Venom kit tuned HW77 (Olly's) I can vouch for the quality of their product.

From what I hear OX springs have a so so reputation... don't forget, a hit with a 11 ft lbs air-rifle is always better than a miss with a 30 ft lbs air-rifle...

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[aandu]

Well, Lots of interesting info out there... I am in the Uk and I do use air-guns here.

Here are some more:
* While you are carrying a rifle between your house and intended shooting place, the gun should be unloaded. When they say unloaded, there should not be a pellet in the breach!
* If you intend to shoot in your back garden... fine, but the pellet's final resting place must be in your back garden. You can be charged if the pellet falls ricochets and ends in your neighbours garden.
* If you are stopped for inspection,your rifle is checked with the pellets you were carrying with the gun, when you were stopped by the police. IF over 12ft lbs, you can be charged... doesn't matter if the guns was tampered to increase the power or not.

Try to find Daystate MK4 S, its something like 30 FP, and Air ranger 50-80 FP (if you can).

Most pcps can be easily taken to 30 FP. I know guys who have taken it to 40 FP! Daystates sell for the price of a state! In fact to the knowledgeable taking a PCP to 30FP is easier! You need no additional components... just the knowledge.

-- Sun Apr 05, 2009 4:12 --

Try Blackpool Air Rifles or Manchester Airguns.

Amongst various laws, one states that the pellet you fire should not cross the boundary of your property.

I met Dr. Q, an IFG member who is based in UK. He could advise you on airguns as well.

Shamsher- the one introduced by BSA recently is R10 (S10 is discontinued). R10 is still under development and not available. Dealers in UK are annoyed, I can tell you that.

As Hamiclar01 suggests, second hand guns, inspected by a known dealer, are good options.

R10 is an excellent & well crafted rifle but has a lot of teething problems! As one gun dealer put it, "...The R10 was designed by geniuses but monkeys are manning the assembly line ......"!

Dont get an R10 for the next 2-3 months. This advice comes from the designer himself. He is now in the process of teaching the monkeys....