SA Wish List for our armed forces

[jonahpach]

Since the armed and special forces of our beloved country seem to have a hard time acquiring/selecting Small Arms and special tactical equipment, lets see what we civis can come up with..

My personal selection for a sniper rifle would be the..
For the Police and Para Military forces
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q201 ... CF0060.jpg
Sako TRG 21 / 22 and TRG 41 / 42 (Finland)
Caliber: TRG 21/22 - 7.62x51mm NATO (.308 Winchester), TRG 41/42 - .300 Winchester magnum and 8.60x70mm (.338 Lapua)
Operation: Bolt Action
Barrel: TRG-22 - 660 mm, TRG-42 - 690 mm
Weight: TRG-22 - 4.7 kg, TRG-42 - 5.1 kg
Length: TRG-22 - 1150 mm, TRG-42 - 1200 mm
Feed Mechanism: TRG-22 - 10 round box mag., TRG-42 - 5 round box mag.

Or the

Stealth Recon Scout (SRS)
(For the Armed Forces)
http://deserttacticalarms.com/photo-gallery.html

Dimensions:
Caliber: 308 WIN
Mag Capacity: 7 rds
Weight: Approx 9.4 lbs
Barrel Length: 22"
Overall Length: 31.5"
Dimensions:
Caliber: 338 LM
Mag Capacity: 5 rds
Weight: Approx 11.6 lbs
Barrel Length: 26"
Overall Length: 37.5"

Features

Quick Barrel Conversion
Fluted Match Free Floated Barrel (Threaded for Suppressor 3/4" x 24")
Adjustable Match Trigger Tapered 34mm One-Piece Rings (available in 20, 35, and 40 MOA tapers)
Pictanny Accessory Rails with Integral Flush Mounted Sling Points
Ergonomic Features

Center Balancing Point with Handle
60 Degree Bolt Lift 1.5"
Adjustable Length of Pull Match Trigger (adjusts from 1 to 6 lbs)
Safety (accessible without removing hand from pistol grip)
Sling Points are perfectly balanced with the centerline of the weapon to ensure lies flat when slung
Rear Support Grip Cheekrest is perfectly optimized with the height of the scope and eye alignment without the need of an adjustable cheekpiece
Magazine Release can be operated with one hand
Contoured Grip Raised Buttpad seates buttbad more securely into the shooters shoulder

[penpusher]

My choice

http://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm? ... ory_id=213


But off course the States are going to buy the hi-tech AK's .If the jokers can't hit something with an Enfield,how are they going to hit something with an AK that is not particularly known for accuracy. Buy a battle rifle for urban policing.Makes a lot of sense,doesn't it.

[MoA]

The rifles in the first pic are the AI-AW and TRG 42. I dont think they are manufacturing the TR22 any longer. The 41/42 superseeded the production.

I have had the cnace to use both of them, and they are perhaps the most accurate rifles out of the box. The caliber I got to shoot with was the .338 LM which does pack quite a kick if used without a muzzle brake or a suppressor.

Either rifle can be had for about 5K Euro's, without accesories (Brake, Suppressor, Bipod, Scope etc).

The SRS seems to be 'inspired by' the DSR-1.

If I remember correctly the SAG used the PSG-1 which is also a decent rifle.

[jonahpach]

I have had the cnace to use both of them, and they are perhaps the most accurate rifles out of the box. The caliber I got to shoot with was the .338 LM which does pack quite a kick if used without a muzzle brake or a suppressor.

Great stuff MoA, but am wondering where you got the chance to try it out?? Would be a great story. Am I jealous! I am at present pulling all the strings I can to get a chance to try out an old dragunov SVD sniper rifle which was captured by the Mizoram Police..

Jonah

[MoA]

The AI belongs to a gentleman I know. Who let me shoot it.
The TRG belongs to the armourer who does a fair bit of work on some of my guns.
I was in the market for a .338 LM however given that most of my shooting is under 1K meters and more often than not under 600.., and a distinct dislike for recoil, made me go the .260 Remington.
Which with the right loads gives me better LR performance than either the .308 or .300 WM.

Plus I didnt want to shell out 7K-10K Euro's for a complete package. I.e. Rifle, spare barrel, dies, bipod, brake, suppressor, scope and mount, especially with the state of the economy. Plus .338 LM ammo is expensive. Even loading your own. Cases are over 1Euro a piece, and the 250 grain scenars are about 50 Euro's/100.
You're looking at about 1 Euro a cartridge if you roll your own, and about 100 Euro's per box of 20 Commercial if you can find it.

SVD's are legal to own as well. Available for under 2K, however the accuracy leaves something to be desired. Very cool looking.

[fantumfan2003]

MoA,

You shot the AI-AW in .338LM ? I envy you man.



Jonah,

.338LM is not recommended for law enforcement outfits, its designed for the military.
The Shri Lankan army uses .338LM AI rifles in our continent.

I have this video of this rifle where the reviewer, makes a 5 shot grouping, bangs the rifle HARD three times and shoots another group without affecting accuracy, then changes the barrel in the field (normally not possible on a sniper rifle and needs a gunsmith). Snipers consider barrels expendable spares. He again shoots a group to show accuracy not getting affected.

[youtube][/youtube]

or here

http://shadowspear.com/vb/showthread.ph ... e3&t=10666

This video left me in awe. This is one kick a%# caliber and rifle.
I'd love to see this rifle in our service.

This rifle is designated L115A3 in the british services. Here is a graphic

http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/0 ... 00x629.jpg

Manish

The AI belongs to a gentleman I know. Who let me shoot it.
The TRG belongs to the armourer who does a fair bit of work on some of my guns.
I was in the market for a .338 LM however given that most of my shooting is under 1K meters and more often than not under 600.., and a distinct dislike for recoil, made me go the .260 Remington.
Which with the right loads gives me better LR performance than either the .308 or .300 WM.

Plus I didnt want to shell out 7K-10K Euro's for a complete package. I.e. Rifle, spare barrel, dies, bipod, brake, suppressor, scope and mount, especially with the state of the economy. Plus .338 LM ammo is expensive. Even loading your own. Cases are over 1Euro a piece, and the 250 grain scenars are about 50 Euro's/100.
You're looking at about 1 Euro a cartridge if you roll your own, and about 100 Euro's per box of 20 Commercial if you can find it.

SVD's are legal to own as well. Available for under 2K, however the accuracy leaves something to be desired. Very cool looking.

[MoA]

fantumman,

Barrells are indeed a consumable item just like ammunition. With the right tools you can change a barrell quite easily and certainly dont need a gunsmith.

A lot of 'accuracy' shooters do have multiple barrells that they use for practise, match and fireforming. And most calibers have fairly short barrell life after which groups tend to open up.

Accuracy in itself is somewhat subjective, for me I am thrilled to be able to shoot .5 MOA or thereabouts. While others I know get upset when they go into .2's, and yet others are happy with 2-3 MoA because their primary use of the weapon is for hunting.

The AI like the TRG is designed as a field rifle and does stand up to a lot of abuse.

A number of Law Enforcement agencies do use the .338 LM as a sniper weapon. Though yes the cartridge was designed for the military.

A number of the shorter ranges (300 m or less) dont allow you to use a .338 LM due to the velocity and energy of the round. Keep in mind that a .338 LM has more energy at 600 meters down range, than the .308 at the muzzle.

[fantumfan2003]

A number of the shorter ranges (300 m or less) dont allow you to use a .338 LM due to the velocity and energy of the round. Keep in mind that a .338 LM has more energy at 600 meters down range, than the .308 at the muzzle.

Indeed that why the British armed forces dropped the 7.62NATO (.308 Win) L96 rifle and did not consider 12.7 (.50 cal ) for the new sniper rifle system.

Which PD's use .338LM ? given its high energy and associated over penetration problems.

M.

[MoA]

Wikipedia link

[penpusher]

Forgot about it.There was a photograph of two fellows with new .315 rifles outside the BMC office as a measure of extra security, post 26/11.Forget which newspaper it was in.