Is it possible to convert a 9mm Luger to fire 9mm short/.380 ACP.If yes what are the modifications that would be required.
Take care,
penpusher
Converting a 9mm para to 9mm short
-
eljefe
- Old Timer
- Posts: 2876
- Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:37 am
penpusher,
Yes, a 9mm Luger has been converted to a 45 Colt.But not here...
The toggle mechanism has served very well in the borchardt, maxim and Luger, but they can be very finicky and may require extensive machining, rechambering and a magazine check for feed reliability.While a technically sound and capable machinist could do it, someone with a experience of retooling a Luger would be ideal...so back to square one! Like the time I tried to take down a mauser broomhandle-like a bloody jigsaw puzzle!
Atleast if it were a junker, one could play around, but a Luger is a Luger, most likely a war trophy or a nicely preserved pre war one?
Best
Axx
Yes, a 9mm Luger has been converted to a 45 Colt.But not here...
The toggle mechanism has served very well in the borchardt, maxim and Luger, but they can be very finicky and may require extensive machining, rechambering and a magazine check for feed reliability.While a technically sound and capable machinist could do it, someone with a experience of retooling a Luger would be ideal...so back to square one! Like the time I tried to take down a mauser broomhandle-like a bloody jigsaw puzzle!
Atleast if it were a junker, one could play around, but a Luger is a Luger, most likely a war trophy or a nicely preserved pre war one?
Best
Axx
''It dont mean a thing, if it aint got that zing!''
"...Oh but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away..."
"...Oh but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away..."
-
penpusher
Its an Artillery Luger with a loooong barrel and a shoulder stock.The barrel is heavily pitted and I am getting it for free.The only problem is the calibre,hence the query.
Take care,
penpusher
PS-If not the .380, maybe it can be converted to 30 Luger/7.65 para. Or maybe .30 Mauser or 7.63 TT. Figured out how to take down the Mauser ?Putting it back together is equally tiresome.Same goes for the Luger
Take care,
penpusher
PS-If not the .380, maybe it can be converted to 30 Luger/7.65 para. Or maybe .30 Mauser or 7.63 TT. Figured out how to take down the Mauser ?Putting it back together is equally tiresome.Same goes for the Luger
-
eljefe
- Old Timer
- Posts: 2876
- Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:37 am
penpusher, given the current scenario here, the 380 would be your best bet.
Any of the other calibers you're interested in would require a new barrel.Will you be able to get the size dimensions of a 9 Vs 380? I think the ammo hand books could be a good source? or if you fail in a google search, Mehul may be a good source of advice for LOA and case dimensions of 9 and 380ACP.
Loong barrel-may be the relatively rarer artillery model,did you get a 30 round snail drum magazine with it too?
Wont it be easier for you to try for a P bore licence? and keep it in original caliber ?(Sorry for being presumptious, Im sure the thought must have come to your mind
)
Best
Axx
Any of the other calibers you're interested in would require a new barrel.Will you be able to get the size dimensions of a 9 Vs 380? I think the ammo hand books could be a good source? or if you fail in a google search, Mehul may be a good source of advice for LOA and case dimensions of 9 and 380ACP.
Loong barrel-may be the relatively rarer artillery model,did you get a 30 round snail drum magazine with it too?
Wont it be easier for you to try for a P bore licence? and keep it in original caliber ?(Sorry for being presumptious, Im sure the thought must have come to your mind
)Best
Axx
''It dont mean a thing, if it aint got that zing!''
"...Oh but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away..."
"...Oh but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away..."
-
Sakobav
- Old Timer
- Posts: 2973
- Joined: Wed May 31, 2006 7:28 pm
- Location: US
Any reason for changing if lic states 38 ?
Still waiting for your previous pistol pictures, at least send the links after google for this one.
Long time ago I saw a regular Luger with a distant relative of mine. The grip is really great , never fired it though to see that lever poping up..considered to be one of the most complex and expensive pistols to manufacture. Enjoy.. did you get any original holster etc with it?
Best of luck
navdeep
Still waiting for your previous pistol pictures, at least send the links after google for this one.
Long time ago I saw a regular Luger with a distant relative of mine. The grip is really great , never fired it though to see that lever poping up..considered to be one of the most complex and expensive pistols to manufacture. Enjoy.. did you get any original holster etc with it?
Best of luck
navdeep
-
penpusher
1.The small matter of the mandatory 'DEATH' penalty in the Arms Act for any death caused by a PB weapon.Any reason for changing if lic states 38 ?
2.Tha provision that states that it would be the responsibility of the accused to prove that he has not made any changes in the weapon as its entered in the license.
3.How would I explain 9mm cartridges and where would I get any?
Still waiting for your previous pistol pictures, at least send the links after google for this one.
Will send pics of the Astra .32 when I figure how to(did take the photos though).Will try to get links for both.Havent got the Luger yet. Its still with my Uncle.Take care,
penpusher
PS-There is a fellow who kept on sending me E-Mails, trying to convince me to sell him the .357 mag and got really nasty when I did not.Would not identify himself though.I hope this does not set him off again.
-
penpusher
Here are the links
for the luger:-
http://www.deactivated-guns.co.uk/detai ... gazine.htm
http://www.zanesgunrack.com/misc_guns.htm
for the Astra Model 3000 :-
http://web.jet.es/rafa/b_spsteel_astra.html
http://www.manebooks.com/firearms/astr3000.htm
Take care,
penpusher
for the luger:-
http://www.deactivated-guns.co.uk/detai ... gazine.htm
http://www.zanesgunrack.com/misc_guns.htm
for the Astra Model 3000 :-
http://web.jet.es/rafa/b_spsteel_astra.html
http://www.manebooks.com/firearms/astr3000.htm
Take care,
penpusher
-
eljefe
- Old Timer
- Posts: 2876
- Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:37 am
1.The small matter of the mandatory 'DEATH' penalty in the Arms Act for any death caused by a PB weapon.
JEEZ, THATS A NEW ONE...
Ha, 380 to 9 - What a predicament! no choice but to go for it.Look, enough techies in your side of the world-enough to give NASA a run for their money-suggest you go for it-the 380 that is.2.Tha provision that states that it would be the responsibility of the accused to prove that he has not made any changes in the weapon as its entered in the license.
Understandable3.How would I explain 9mm cartridges and where would I get any?
Is the luger for similar emailsPS-There is a fellow who kept on sending me E-Mails, trying to convince me to sell him the .357 mag and got really nasty when I did not.Would not identify himself though.I hope this does not set him off again
Best
Axx
''It dont mean a thing, if it aint got that zing!''
"...Oh but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away..."
"...Oh but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away..."
-
Sakobav
- Old Timer
- Posts: 2973
- Joined: Wed May 31, 2006 7:28 pm
- Location: US
-
Sakobav
- Old Timer
- Posts: 2973
- Joined: Wed May 31, 2006 7:28 pm
- Location: US
-
mehulkamdar
penpusher,
Artillery Lugers with all accessories can be very valuable in the west. A pitted barrel could be replaced and the pistol reconditioned and still sell for a reasonable price. If you're going to get it and could get the neccessary export permits, I could put you in touch with people who might be interested in buying it.
Let me know if you're interested in taking this route,
Mehul
Artillery Lugers with all accessories can be very valuable in the west. A pitted barrel could be replaced and the pistol reconditioned and still sell for a reasonable price. If you're going to get it and could get the neccessary export permits, I could put you in touch with people who might be interested in buying it.
Let me know if you're interested in taking this route,
Mehul
-
Mark
- Veteran
- Posts: 1147
- Joined: Sat Jun 03, 2006 10:37 am
- Location: Middle USA
Re: Converting a 9mm para to 9mm short
penpusher,
I think the best route is talk with Mehul and see what is involved in getting the gun exported. As he has mentioned, artillery lugers can bring a fair amount of money depending on the condition and accessories, etc. You might be able to sell it and with the money buy a real gun.
However, if you choose to keep it here is a backwoods remedy for your problem I believe- The OAL of a 9mm para case is .754 (19.15 mm), the OAL of a 380 is .680 (17.27 mm). The difference is .074 (1.88 mm). I will double check these numbers tomorrow, my main reference book is in the bedroom and my wife is sleeping right now.
Anyway, I believe you could cut a .074" length from the end of an empty case and solder or epoxy it into the chamber and that will serve to provide a shoulder for the case to headspace upon, and will also prevent 9mm ammo from being used in the gun. If I had to do it, I would turn a collar out of steel on a lathe and make it half a thousandth oversize and then it would stay in with friction and you wouldn't have to worry about it coming out when the gun gets hot and the epoxy melts.
Don't expect stellar accuracy from this mod, but should work fine for 25-50 yards. It may not have enough energy to move the slide however unless you handload.
I think the best route is talk with Mehul and see what is involved in getting the gun exported. As he has mentioned, artillery lugers can bring a fair amount of money depending on the condition and accessories, etc. You might be able to sell it and with the money buy a real gun.
However, if you choose to keep it here is a backwoods remedy for your problem I believe- The OAL of a 9mm para case is .754 (19.15 mm), the OAL of a 380 is .680 (17.27 mm). The difference is .074 (1.88 mm). I will double check these numbers tomorrow, my main reference book is in the bedroom and my wife is sleeping right now.
Anyway, I believe you could cut a .074" length from the end of an empty case and solder or epoxy it into the chamber and that will serve to provide a shoulder for the case to headspace upon, and will also prevent 9mm ammo from being used in the gun. If I had to do it, I would turn a collar out of steel on a lathe and make it half a thousandth oversize and then it would stay in with friction and you wouldn't have to worry about it coming out when the gun gets hot and the epoxy melts.
Don't expect stellar accuracy from this mod, but should work fine for 25-50 yards. It may not have enough energy to move the slide however unless you handload.
-
eljefe
- Old Timer
- Posts: 2876
- Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 3:37 am
-
penpusher
Re: Converting a 9mm para to 9mm short
Mark,
Thanks. Hadn't thought of this.Was thinking more in terms of setting back the barrel and putting in a weaker spring. Handloading is prohibited in India. Will talk to my gunsmith about this solution.Considering the fact that weapons are hard to come by as result of the import ban and prohibitively expensive, would prefer to keep the pistol, escpecially as it is for free.
Take care,
penpusher
Thanks. Hadn't thought of this.Was thinking more in terms of setting back the barrel and putting in a weaker spring. Handloading is prohibited in India. Will talk to my gunsmith about this solution.Considering the fact that weapons are hard to come by as result of the import ban and prohibitively expensive, would prefer to keep the pistol, escpecially as it is for free.
Take care,
penpusher
-
Mark
- Veteran
- Posts: 1147
- Joined: Sat Jun 03, 2006 10:37 am
- Location: Middle USA
Re: Converting a 9mm para to 9mm short
Before I'd set the barrel back for such a low powered round, I would open up the chamber area and make a steel bushing, then use a reamer and finish the new chamber that way.
However, as mentioned earlier I really like to keep things original, and using a case or making a steel insert bushing will enable the gun to be used and also converted back whenever the gun laws in your country change for the better.
Out of curiosity, do you know the history of this gun? I bet it would be pretty interesting.
However, as mentioned earlier I really like to keep things original, and using a case or making a steel insert bushing will enable the gun to be used and also converted back whenever the gun laws in your country change for the better.
Out of curiosity, do you know the history of this gun? I bet it would be pretty interesting.