Which is a better performer and a preferred buy the AK550 or the SDB Model 300?

[sam 47]

Would love to someday, but as it is not possible now, please tell me what exactly are the sizes of groups shot with IHP 35 and hurricane at 100 yards?
And how exactly do you shoot? Most of these shot require a holdover of 4-5 feet.

[nitroex700]

Would love to someday, but as it is not possible now, please tell me what exactly are the sizes of groups shot with IHP 35 and hurricane at 100 yards?
And how exactly do you shoot? Most of these shot require a holdover of 4-5 feet.

Holdover was never a problem for sharpshooters, crosswind and wind direction is! Even the vertical element of wind comes into play...
I simply zero my gun at 60-70yds and be done with it.. Although there will be people questioning the height of the trajectory etc but my basic objective here is reduce the holdover to within my scope objective which it does perfectly alright..

--
Nitroex

[sam 47]

That explains the holdover, I can see your sole purpose is long range shooting, but what exactly are the sizes of the groups? I am not going towards IHP 35, but how tight does the Hurricane shoot on an average?
And what scope do you use and how many mildots does it have?

[Basu]

100 mts shooting with a 12 fpe springer, is tall ask.
I can say , with Sport , which is 12-13 fpe gun , I can hit 2.5"x 2.5" at 50 yds .
I even can not imagine the size of grouping at 100 mts since I never tried.
At 100 mts , the pellet will be left with 2+ FP energy which is little too low to negotiate with wind.
I am very keen to see such long distance groupings.

Basu

[nitroex700]

For Hurricane, in minimal wind, sub-2MOA, when shooting prone with a shooting bag. I shoot the IHP sitting on most occasions as I find it fairly suitable for offhand shooting -> 2-2.5" at 90-100yds.
Now I don't go all nuts about it and begin measuring stuff with digital callipers, looking to find the 'centre' of 5.5mm hole.. I try to carry as little gear with myself as possible since I shoot in a jungle on most occasions.. So I simply take the two farthest shots and use my thumb (which coincidentally is exactly 2.5" long..) to measure the distance between them..

I use a cheap chinese 4x20 scope - its duplex reticle measures about 30" across at 100yds, which is what I use to make my calculations.. I wouldn't risk an expensive imported scope on a recoiling springer - primarily because importing those things is normally a very good way to make anonymous gifts to faceless customs officials.. The scope has been quite reliable imho - I banged and broke one of its prisms and it developed a 'crack' near the bottom.. yet it still functions flawlessly and continues to put the rounds where they're expected to land...

100 mts shooting with a 12 fpe springer, is tall ask.
I can say , with Sport , which is 12-13 fpe gun , I can hit 2.5"x 2.5" at 50 yds .
I even can not imagine the size of grouping at 100 mts since I never tried.
At 100 mts , the pellet will be left with 2+ FP energy which is little too low to negotiate with wind.
I am very keen to see such long distance groupings.

Basu

Do come down to Allahabad some time Sir, it will be fun to shoot together with our mutual friend.. We often plink together at 4" wide targets at 50 yards on Sundays..

The varying wind does play spoilsport even at that distance. However the trick is to take the shot at a time when the wind is blowing at a steady speed and avoid the temptation to pull the trigger when it is increasing or decreasing.. Then keep taking the shots whenever the wind is the same as when you took the last shot.. You only need about 0.8s-1s to hit the target at 100-110yds - If the wind is steady and your pellet is decent enough, chances are your grouping will be very similar to what you get at 50-60yd...

Regards -
Nitroex

[Basu]

Dear Nitroex,
Nice to note your performance at 100 mtrs.
You are gifted shooter.

Basu

[nitroex700]

Dear Nitroex,
Nice to note your performance at 100 mtrs.
You are gifted shooter.

Basu

Thanks a lot for the undeserved praise Sir. I feel that once we have the holdover calculated, it all comes down to wind reading practice for long range shots. Until now I didn't require a 'ballistic chart' for the ranges I've shot at, but as I push the envelope of my gun beyond 110yd, the snail slow speed of the pellet necessitates the creation of one.. What has continued to surprise me is the fact that the pellet is still spinning perfectly even with just 1fpe of life left in it - meaning the loss of rotational energy occurs at a much slower rate than the KE...

[vsraja]

To my knowledge and understanding even a less than 10fpe gun can be used for a long range shots.Provided the piston and breach seal is in their best conditions to provide a consistent compression.Here the main variable is the pellet weight and dimensions.Mostly a heavier pellet with good ballistic coefficient will make the pellet capable of carrying the energy from muzzle to target with minimum loss in the energy during the flight.Also have to bear in mind that ,for a given pellet, even a 15 or 20fpe energy gun can produce the same or very near to the 10fpe gun's energy at 100mtrs or beyond, if the ballistic coefficient of the pellet is poor.So we need a right pellet to match our range and purpose.

[sam 47]

Pellets have the lowest BCs, the point of the skirt being to slow down the projectile. Unless, the pellet starts at a high velocity ... I mean the optimum velocity, it simply wont retain enough energy out to 100 yards. For a 15 fpe pellet to retain 10 fpe at 100 yards, the BC must be close to 0.1. The best of pellets have BC around .05. 0.1 is about for the low end bullets. To increase BC simply increasing the weight would not work.
And increasing the weight of the pellet makes it unsuitable for most pellet rifles. Two uber heavy .177s are Eun Jin and JSB beast weighing a shade over 16 grains. They have a very high BC of about .0045, but they are simply not meant for sub 15 fpe air rifles. A spring gun will produce the worst possible accuracy with them, and have massive piston bounce. Moreover the mismatch of pellets weight to piston weight will reduce energy at the muzzle.
The BC of a pellet is sectional density by form factor. SD is proportional to mass, so BC increases with caliber.
A 10 fpe pellet will travel to 100 yards all right, heck my 3 fpe gun travels to 45 yards, but it is more like tossing the pellets rather than shooting them at that distance.

[ashokharsana]

I have tried 70 meters distance while shooting a 10 inch diameter steel plate. It was like 8 out of 10 with sdb 45. That gun produced hardly 8-9 fpe in my opinion (less than 500 fps as tested on chrono connect mobile app).

Got my new vx100 just two days ago and will be trying 70+ meter target on sunday when I visit my farm. But hoenstly speaking managing 1.5 inch group with a springer states that you must be a very eleigible shooter. Any springer taking on 100 meter target is an amzing thing, and as righty quoted by sam47, long range shooting (with some serious accuracy) is possible only with a pcp producing 1200-1300 fps such as benjamine marauder and sorts.

Happy shooting

[Basu]

Dear Ashok,
Is there any AR called artemis sdb 45 ?
SDB 45 is max 9-10 Fpe AR ,where as Artemis is 13-14 Fpe.

Basu

[sam 47]

Ashok sir, hitting anything with a air rifle that consistently breaks the sound barrier even at 10 metres is a real pain. I have first hand experience regarding this. The ideal AR velocities are 900-950 fps , and 1000-1020 fps is practically the upper limit. The reason why the PCPs are able to shoot long distances is because they use heavy pellets to attain 900+ velocity mark, and the heavy pellets retain that energy up to a comparatively longer distance.

[ashokharsana]

Dear Ashok,
Is there any AR called artemis sdb 45 ?
SDB 45 is max 9-10 Fpe AR ,where as Artemis is 13-14 Fpe.

Basu

Oops, my mistake, thanks for correcting sir, it was sdb45 actually, have been reading a lot about sdb artemis for the past few months and these two words sdb and artemis have become same for me..