Th SDB Classic Special Edition Up Grade

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SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by Big Daddy » Sun Jun 07, 2015 10:04 pm

Firstly, I would like to make it very clear that all opinions in this post are mine based on my experience.

Secondly, I do not represent, support, promote, demote or market any ones opinions or any air rifle brand.

Thirdly, this post is about a product the way I experienced it. So let's get on with it....

I love springers (over PCP) because I find it takes much more to ensure a springer is on mark than a PCP. After shooting RWS 350 magnums, Baikal, BSA etc I decided I needed an Indian AR of my own. My first choice was the Canon 65 (there is a thread of that) after a lot of discussion with Tirtha (may his soul rest in peace). Once I received the AR, it was tested with senior members and my good friends PK Jeetesh and Lucky Luke at Jeetesh’s shooting range. For the newer members, these guys are gurus in AR’s and a minefield of knowledge. I’m sure reputed seniors like Brihacharanji can vouch for that. I had the opportunity since then to experience quiet a number of Indian AR’s, none of them living to the experience of the well tuned cannon (at this point, I would like those who’s eyebrows are raising to refer to the first sentence of this post). :lol:
Then came this chatter of a so called ‘SDB’. This was at first like certain other posts ...bla...bla...bla. But something told me it must be different because I know certain ‘grumpies’ who liked the AR. I came in contact with someone well known to the production house. This led to another intro then another....then to Basuji. We discussed a ton on the dynamics and physics of AR’s etc. One thing that surprised me about Mr. Basu was his neutrality and respect for AR manufacturers. I expected him to be a SDB fanatic. Yes he likes SDB but appreciates well made AR’s from others and is in love with his IHP, which is bloody accurate.

Anyway, SDB was developing their best AR so far, the Classic Special Edition after lot of inputs from various sources on the physics behind an AR. This February, I had the great privilege of being given the first prototype to test and give feedback.
This AR is a delight and I would put it far ahead of the Canon. I will not vouch for other models from this manufacturer as I have not tried them. But the Special Edition is a ‘go ahead’ right away.

Firstly what I did not like about the SDB Classic Special Edition.

Image
SDB needs to introduce safety to their trigger. PH has taken the lead and set the bench mark. Others need to follow.
Construction of the trigger blade. Works perfectly, feels good, needs to look good....a little vanity won’t hurt I guess.

Continuing on the cosmetic front, I do not like cocking levers to be exposed. This remains the same in this version of SDB as in all other Indian rifles I have come across, save the PH. Again hats off to the PH team.

What I really like about the SDB Classic Special Edition and the Five big surprises

Image
The bluing is perfect. It’s dark and even. I looked for uneven shades but couldn't find any. Whoever does their bluing is a master. “Wow” is the word.
Front and rear sites are solid, typical Diana. Back site has the usual vertical and horizontal adjustments and is a V notch. I prefer the V to a U. That’s personal perhaps...or do you guys feel the same? Anyway I will not waste time on the sites as they are standard.
Image
Image
Image
Image
The rifles comes with a factory fitted 11 mm scope mount welded to the AR, with a scope stop. A nice thought.
Image
The balance is PERFECT, in fact amazing. This was the first big surprise. I find it as comfortable as holding my RWS 34 or a Crossman. Was really amazed. The artillery hold is a thrill with this toy. Balance perfecto.
The second big surprise was the recoil. After cleaning the rifle, I loaded Master Shot and G Smith pellets and fired specifically to observe vibration. Boy! The recoil is literally a dull ‘thud’ and feels good. There is almost no way the recoil from this AR is going to adversely affect accuracy. Lovely. The thud actually feels good.....oops! did I mentioned that earlier??? But yes, the recoil is very well absorbed....and feels good.....aaahhhhh getting addicted to this recoil. Gota move on :twisted:
Now the third surprise was the power. I definitely am not one of those super humans out there who want to take a sniper shot from 100 meters away with an AR. But I do appreciate descent power coupled with accuracy. This baby packs a punch. I do not have a chronograph, but in comparison to AR’s with known FPS that I have used, I would comfortably gauge her at around 580 to 610 fps. I took a 600 GSM bath towel, folded it in two, dipped it in water, hung it and shot from 10 meters at a coke tin suspended in front of the towel with the idea the towel would stop the pellet from impacting the wall behind it. The pellet went straight through the can and towel. A 600 GSM towel is a standard turkey towel that has a dry weight of 1 Kg (aprox). This should give an idea.
Out of the box, she is quiet accurate for a rifle that has not yet fully ‘broken in’. Hitting Himalaya water Bottle caps (the pink ones) is a breeze at 10 meters. However the group opens to around 3 inches at 20 meters. I’m sure once she breaks in, accuracy will be the norm. Will keep the forum updated on that.
The fourth surprise was a neoprene breech seal. What better breach seal can one ask for? Correct me if I’m wrong, but no AR in the country has a neoprene breach seal. When I saw the breach seal, I knew I was right in going after a SDB.
Image
Now the fifth and biggest surprise....the trigger. Yes, I had mentioned about the safety and the trigger blade, but the trigger was the actual surprise. After verifying with SDB on the triggers performance, I came to know this trigger was newly designed for this rifle. After tuning the trigger, the breaking point is only 940 grams....yes believe it or not, 940 grams. I have since re-tried the triggers breaking point and it remains an average of 940 grams for five pulls. It’s nothing short of sweet.

The second prototype rifle was recently given to our forum member Lawman and I’m sure he is enjoying it.
With some very specific feedbacks given, which SDB is working on, I’m sure once this AR is on sale, enthusiast will have one more great option.

Image

Image

BTW...from when will this rifle be available? Well I don’t really know. I was told SDB want to ensure the product is perfect before retail production.

And why don’t I really know??? Please refer to the second sentence in this post. :)

I scoped my rifle with a Gamo 3 – 12 X 50 AOE

BD
Last edited by Big Daddy on Sun Jun 07, 2015 11:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by kshitij » Sun Jun 07, 2015 10:51 pm

Good to see the manufacturer taking active interest in customer opinion and implementing the recommendations. PH has set the benchmark, it would be good to see others catch up and keep the competetive spirit going :cheers:
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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by brihacharan » Mon Jun 08, 2015 10:49 am

Hi Big Daddy,
> Very nice evaluation of the newly introduced SDB Special / Classic in 22 cal :D
> How true - when competition knocks on your doors - you wake to certain ground realities & try to get one up :D :D :D
> BTW - Pl. convey my regards to PKJ & Lucky Luke when you meet them next.....
Briha

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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by Basu » Mon Jun 08, 2015 11:35 am

Dear Big Daddy,
Went through your post very carefully.
Since you used many Indian and imported guns , so your words are worthy.
When you rate SDB SE over Cannon 65 , that gives me impression that this gun has more to offer in every respect.
Cannon35/65 has been one the best guns that I ever fired among all Indian springers.
I think breech seal and trigger are the special features of SDB SE along with velocity.
I have not seen any indian springer really sustaining at 12 ft/lbs energy over a period of time.
Only one IHP that I have seen which neared 12 ft/lbs mark , that of Ifgian Moilendu 610 fps with 14.3 grns , tuned with TTI Kit.
(Pl.note I meant what I have come to know).
Most of the springers hover between 8.5 to 10 ft/lbs energy.
I hope , if you could Chrono SDB SE , the truth will be revealed.
Having seen your crude experiment with turkish towel , gives me hint that this gun may deliver 11 ft/lbs energy for sure if tuned.
My SDB 45 went upto 10.3 ft/lbs enengy , so on the basis of that it is my assumption.
Trigger is most crucial that gives accuracy.
A 940 grms trigger release, must be a blissful experience.
I am longing to test fire this gun soon.
I am keen to know that with this power and trigger , what is the group size at 10 mtrs.
Your Gomo scope made me weak , to be honest.


Basu
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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by moulindu » Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:03 pm

Hi
Thats a very informative & well descriptive review of the improved SDB. I will buy one if its available in 0.177.
Basu wrote:I have not seen any indian springer really sustaining at 12 ft/lbs energy over a period of time.
Only one IHP that I have seen which neared 12 ft/lbs mark , that of Ifgian Moilendu 610 fps with 14.3 grns , tuned with TTI Kit.
Well i thought i was not the only one in the category. I have measured velocity of my TTI tuned IHP 35 in .022 cal using softchrono & chronoconnect. I was using softchrono with my laptop & chronoconnect with smart phone simultaneously. The softchrono results were too high to my liking clicking around 640 fps whereas the chronoconnect results were 610-615. Then i seeked help from Basuda sending him the audio file recorded in my smartphone for a string of 5 shots & send it to him. Basuda used audacity software to determine the velocity which was 590, which i guess is for 5yds, so there is a conversion factor used by basuda for RH (0.95) & FH pellets, if I am not mistaken. By dividing the velocity with factor(0.95) the muzzle velocity comes to be around 621fps. So I am feeding the results obtained from Basuda in the ballistic calculator for shooting. But despite of such velocity i find it very easy to shoot. I have 80% hit at coke bottle caps at 10mts freehand using the same mastershot RH export quality pellets.
Regards Moulindu

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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by Big Daddy » Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:26 pm

Hi Moulindu,
Looks like it's a case of beauty and the beast :D
Yes. This gun surprised me. Once she breaks in I will post target groups at 10 meters.

BD
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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by Big Daddy » Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:24 pm

Yes Basu, canon is a good rifle but they seem to have lost focus. I remember hitting a fat 2 inch bolt at 30 meters. I heard of late their guns are unreasonable priced. Not my opinion. Just heard.

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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by ganeshn » Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:41 am

Big Daddy wrote:Firstly, I would like to make it very clear that all opinions in this post are mine based on my experience.

Secondly, I do not represent, support, promote, demote or market any ones opinions or any air rifle brand.

Thirdly, this post is about a product the way I experienced it. So let's get on with it....

I love springers (over PCP) because I find it takes much more to ensure a springer is on mark than a PCP. After shooting RWS 350 magnums, Baikal, BSA etc I decided I needed an Indian AR of my own. My first choice was the Canon 65 (there is a thread of that) after a lot of discussion with Tirtha (may his soul rest in peace). Once I received the AR, it was tested with senior members and my good friends PK Jeetesh and Lucky Luke at Jeetesh’s shooting range. For the newer members, these guys are gurus in AR’s and a minefield of knowledge. I’m sure reputed seniors like Brihacharanji can vouch for that. I had the opportunity since then to experience quiet a number of Indian AR’s, none of them living to the experience of the well tuned cannon (at this point, I would like those who’s eyebrows are raising to refer to the first sentence of this post). :lol:
Then came this chatter of a so called ‘SDB’. This was at first like certain other posts ...bla...bla...bla. But something told me it must be different because I know certain ‘grumpies’ who liked the AR. I came in contact with someone well known to the production house. This led to another intro then another....then to Basuji. We discussed a ton on the dynamics and physics of AR’s etc. One thing that surprised me about Mr. Basu was his neutrality and respect for AR manufacturers. I expected him to be a SDB fanatic. Yes he likes SDB but appreciates well made AR’s from others and is in love with his IHP, which is bloody accurate.

Anyway, SDB was developing their best AR so far, the Classic Special Edition after lot of inputs from various sources on the physics behind an AR. This February, I had the great privilege of being given the first prototype to test and give feedback.
This AR is a delight and I would put it far ahead of the Canon. I will not vouch for other models from this manufacturer as I have not tried them. But the Special Edition is a ‘go ahead’ right away.

Firstly what I did not like about the SDB Classic Special Edition.

[ Image ]
SDB needs to introduce safety to their trigger. PH has taken the lead and set the bench mark. Others need to follow.
Construction of the trigger blade. Works perfectly, feels good, needs to look good....a little vanity won’t hurt I guess.

Continuing on the cosmetic front, I do not like cocking levers to be exposed. This remains the same in this version of SDB as in all other Indian rifles I have come across, save the PH. Again hats off to the PH team.

What I really like about the SDB Classic Special Edition and the Five big surprises

[ Image ]
The bluing is perfect. It’s dark and even. I looked for uneven shades but couldn't find any. Whoever does their bluing is a master. “Wow” is the word.
Front and rear sites are solid, typical Diana. Back site has the usual vertical and horizontal adjustments and is a V notch. I prefer the V to a U. That’s personal perhaps...or do you guys feel the same? Anyway I will not waste time on the sites as they are standard.
[ Image ]
[ Image ]
[ Image ]
[ Image ]
The rifles comes with a factory fitted 11 mm scope mount welded to the AR, with a scope stop. A nice thought.
[ Image ]
The balance is PERFECT, in fact amazing. This was the first big surprise. I find it as comfortable as holding my RWS 34 or a Crossman. Was really amazed. The artillery hold is a thrill with this toy. Balance perfecto.
The second big surprise was the recoil. After cleaning the rifle, I loaded Master Shot and G Smith pellets and fired specifically to observe vibration. Boy! The recoil is literally a dull ‘thud’ and feels good. There is almost no way the recoil from this AR is going to adversely affect accuracy. Lovely. The thud actually feels good.....oops! did I mentioned that earlier??? But yes, the recoil is very well absorbed....and feels good.....aaahhhhh getting addicted to this recoil. Gota move on :twisted:
Now the third surprise was the power. I definitely am not one of those super humans out there who want to take a sniper shot from 100 meters away with an AR. But I do appreciate descent power coupled with accuracy. This baby packs a punch. I do not have a chronograph, but in comparison to AR’s with known FPS that I have used, I would comfortably gauge her at around 580 to 610 fps. I took a 600 GSM bath towel, folded it in two, dipped it in water, hung it and shot from 10 meters at a coke tin suspended in front of the towel with the idea the towel would stop the pellet from impacting the wall behind it. The pellet went straight through the can and towel. A 600 GSM towel is a standard turkey towel that has a dry weight of 1 Kg (aprox). This should give an idea.
Out of the box, she is quiet accurate for a rifle that has not yet fully ‘broken in’. Hitting Himalaya water Bottle caps (the pink ones) is a breeze at 10 meters. However the group opens to around 3 inches at 20 meters. I’m sure once she breaks in, accuracy will be the norm. Will keep the forum updated on that.
The fourth surprise was a neoprene breech seal. What better breach seal can one ask for? Correct me if I’m wrong, but no AR in the country has a neoprene breach seal. When I saw the breach seal, I knew I was right in going after a SDB.
[ Image ]
Now the fifth and biggest surprise....the trigger. Yes, I had mentioned about the safety and the trigger blade, but the trigger was the actual surprise. After verifying with SDB on the triggers performance, I came to know this trigger was newly designed for this rifle. After tuning the trigger, the breaking point is only 940 grams....yes believe it or not, 940 grams. I have since re-tried the triggers breaking point and it remains an average of 940 grams for five pulls. It’s nothing short of sweet.

The second prototype rifle was recently given to our forum member Lawman and I’m sure he is enjoying it.
With some very specific feedbacks given, which SDB is working on, I’m sure once this AR is on sale, enthusiast will have one more great option.

[ Image ]

[ Image ]

BTW...from when will this rifle be available? Well I don’t really know. I was told SDB want to ensure the product is perfect before retail production.

And why don’t I really know??? Please refer to the second sentence in this post. :)

I scoped my rifle with a Gamo 3 – 12 X 50 AOE

BD
Proof of the pudding is in eating ( not the plating ), havent seen the groups of SDBxx at 30 yards in a while.

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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by Big Daddy » Tue Jun 09, 2015 3:45 pm

Dear Ganashan,

Well said. We :cheers:
have seen over the year’s lot of pre-plated puddings that turns out to be something else.

It’s nice to see Indian companies progressing after so many years of hibernation.

The fact that, for example PH has identified one of the best brains in the industry, Dr. Shirsat, shows the seriousness in offering high standards.

IHP realised what they had lost and tried to compensate with the fibre stock to “look new” (IMHO).

Cannon is a good toy but again, they are deep in hibernation. Now SDB has woken up and they are good. I say so because I have experienced it and much more.

A couple of weeks ago, a friend was hitting Alfonse mangoes at about 30 to 40 meters away. I have a 20 m Bosh laser meter and judging from its maximum reach, it was at the mentioned range.

I tried it at 20 meters on half a brick lying in the orchard. It was very good. I did not mention that because it was the first time I used his AR. For me to talk on the performance, I will need to know all the tweaks done. But yes, the model I have is a very pleasant surprise. I have shot many brands and have a general idea, and this is one is satisfying.

This will be a great option if the production is done to this standard.

Yes and as you mentioned, it’s high time we had some more good pudding. For the 30 yards, I'll give a feed back once my AR breaks in. Till them it's going to be the RWS for long shots. :D

BD
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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by anubhav_rulez » Wed Jun 10, 2015 5:29 pm

Hi All,
Have used SDB product in the past. It was SDB 200 model. A straight shooter out of the box...no twings, spring cry while cocking. I wasn't aware of tuning things for ARS that time, but still it was bang on target & very powerful.
Now coming to this one...Its looking perfectly blued, awesome breach seal. Wooden stock had always been my first love.
Though Iam not any expert...but still would like to have little checkring on pistol grip & forearm. Trigger pull was heavier in my SDB but that wasnt tuned. Let's cross our fingers & hope for the best.
Anubhav Bajpai
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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by abhi11 » Wed Jun 10, 2015 9:23 pm

Hi BD

I tried your gun out while i was at hyd... its just awesome..but i felt the trigger is less than 900gms...well i just got mine which breaks below 450gms.

I will post the details shortly while i get net on my laptop..
Regards
Abhi


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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by Lawman » Thu Jun 11, 2015 2:59 am

Congratulation BD for the excellent air rifle you got. The air rifle deserves the complement as written by BD. I am the fortunate person to get the second prototype air rifle produced by SDB. I am not an expert of air-gun. But when I fired the gun first time, it gave me a pleasant surprise. It has a superior trigger system and tremendous power.

The points of the air rifle has already discussed by BD. So, I am not repeating those as my experience is same. The air rifle is awesome and the thing surprised me is more after the trigger, is it’s power. In short I can say please do not try the air-rifle for deal wood test. It may fail :wink: The pellet was smashed when fired on cement floor from 8” distance. This SDB air rifle is truly a collectable item and the SDB-45 Classic SE proudly made its place in my arsenal.

Lawman

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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by mthayeb » Fri Jun 19, 2015 3:29 am

Hi All,

@ BD and Lawman.. Great that you have managed to test the pre-release of SDB 45 SE..

Any idea when these gonna be available in retail outlets ? As may have noticed.. i collect only India Airguns, and i liked SDB since i tested their SDB 2000 model. Reading the review by BD, i really want to buy one of this.

Is there anyway i can get a pre-release version of SDB 45..? Please let me know how.

Regards

Mthayeb

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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by Vikram » Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:27 pm

Big Daddy,

One of the best photo reviews on this forum. Thank you for the contribution.


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Re: SDB Classic – SE (Special Edition) . 22

Post by ckkalyan » Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:42 pm

Excellent review Big Daddy and painstaking effort, I am sure! A labour of love? Kudos. (y) :D

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