Weird Query

[Chandan22]

Hello,

Someone I know met a Police dy. commissioner in another state and got to discussing shooting as a sport. My friend brought the conversation round to the difficulty of getting into the sport due to the issues of getting an arms licence. To this the policeman asked "why do you want to get into firearms sports? Use air guns.. and even if you want firearms sports, you should first become a renowned shooter with airguns and get practise then apply for a licence."

I found this very weird. I mean its like saying first participate in a bicycle race and win and only then try to participate in a car race.. or like first learn and win at badminton before starting tennis !

But the problem remains, how do you answer this? Or does it make logical sense?

I plan to apply for an arms licence in Delhi soon. My objective is to get into Pistol and Rifle shooting and I don't see why I should start with an air pistol or something. I do have some informal experience with firearms in the past.

Thoughts?

~chandan

[Vikram]

I would politely thank him for his advice. After that, I would register with NRAI and/or a local shooting association, and apply for the license with sport shooting being the reason.


Best-
Vikram

[inplainsight]

Listen to Vikram, submit your application and wait for their decision.

Read this post http://www.indiansforguns.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=20173

[AgentDoubleS]

Chandan,

It's a rubbish suggestion- if you don't want to start with an air rifle, you don't have to.

I had participated in 3-4 GV Mavalankar tournaments (in .22 rifle category) and when I applied for a license it was rejected stating many years have passed since I had last participated. I appealed in the LG's court, won and got a license.

Regards,
SS

[fantumfan2003]

And this is the silly view held by some of the shooting bodies in some states too.......

M.

Hello,

Someone I know met a Police dy. commissioner in another state and got to discussing shooting as a sport. My friend brought the conversation round to the difficulty of getting into the sport due to the issues of getting an arms licence. To this the policeman asked "why do you want to get into firearms sports? Use air guns.. and even if you want firearms sports, you should first become a renowned shooter with airguns and get practise then apply for a licence."

I found this very weird. I mean its like saying first participate in a bicycle race and win and only then try to participate in a car race.. or like first learn and win at badminton before starting tennis !

But the problem remains, how do you answer this? Or does it make logical sense?

I plan to apply for an arms licence in Delhi soon. My objective is to get into Pistol and Rifle shooting and I don't see why I should start with an air pistol or something. I do have some informal experience with firearms in the past.

Thoughts?

~chandan

[nagarifle]

gents there is no legal requirement to take part in any games to get arms license, this requirement is LA made one thus has no ground in court when challenged the problem is that very few are willing to spend 40k or so to go to court. and no one makes a public announcement when they win the case to encourage others. yes its like saying that if you want to have a driving license then you must take part in formula one first.

[Safarigent]

NRAI is not accepting any new membership applications.

[jashwantsinh]

Yes, NARI not accpeting new membership application now a days, but, guess likely to start accpeting by this
Monday i.e. 15/07/2013, according to the sources.
Chandan22, please keep checking with NRAI office at Delhi, if at all you wish to get registered with.
I understand, and also as Safarigent wrote that having NRAI membership does help and strengthen your application till great extent.

[Chandan22]

Gentlemen,

Thanks for the thoughts...

I am already a DSRA member. I also have a Civilian Rifle Training Program certificate from way back in 2002, which is when I did proper shooting for the first time.

Till a couple of months ago I was actively thinking of getting an Air Pistol to get back in the game so to speak. But then I thought it just won't be the same, so why get into the mode of partial satisfaction. Funnily I was shooting at an air range in Delhi a few weeks back, after a loooong time.. and the instructor there commented I was holding the pistol too tightly, which was cause of my experience only with firearms in the past and I was expecting a recoil...
that was crazily a defining moment of sorts.. and I thought I'll rather pursue a licence than get into the air gun game.

Thanks for all your advice. I plan to apply soon. Just waiting for some address documentation etc to get closed up. I was just a little taken aback by that cops comments.. felt I had to share...

Hope to get more advice from you all once I do apply...

btw, another thing making the rounds is that a call from a sitting MP/Minister ensures quick granting of the licence? any one has any ideas on that? would prefer to use that route actually.. less hassle and quicker to get on the range !!!!!!

~Chandan

[AgentDoubleS]

btw, another thing making the rounds is that a call from a sitting MP/Minister ensures quick granting of the licence? any one has any ideas on that? would prefer to use that route actually.. less hassle and quicker to get on the range !!!!!!

~Chandan

If hassles are what you are attempting to dodge shooting is not the sport for you in India. Play carrom. I'm not sure you realise how disdainfully such comments are looked at at this forum.

[Chandan22]

Hello SS,

I don't understand why there would be disdain?

The objective is to participate and enjoy a sport. The hassles are procedural issues which are not inherent to the sport but a legacy of the raj and other associated issues/perspectives/circumstances. They have nothing to do with the sport per se or even my sporting ability or sportsmanship or anything.

Now if your contention is something along the lines of " the difficulties build character .... " maybe you have a point but I don't quite agree. My own viewpoint would be to get over these illogical hurdles as quickly as possible and focus on my shooting. If I look for shortcuts in my shooting and practice and all that, I will agree with you if you show disdain... but trying to find a way to start shooting quickly should not in my opinion.

However, I respect your opinion and your entitlement to air it, but will look forward to showing you that I'm not really that contemptible, through deeds in the sport not words.

~Chandan

[AgentDoubleS]

Hello SS,

I don't understand why there would be disdain?

~Chandan

Hi Chandan,

When you say you are willing to use political contacts to get an arms license the moral debate goes much beyond excelling in shooting sports.

The forum in which you posted your query is "RIGHT to keep and bear arms" - not Privilege to keep and bear arms. It stands for fighting for our rights no matter what caste, creed, section or financial strata of the society we come from.

There are multiple stories on this forum of people who have forgone the temptation to take shortcuts and have stood up to get what our constitution guarantees us- our right to keep and bear arms. For every weakness an individual shows, for every exception or shortcut an individual takes, for every attempt s/he makes to use political influence to get what is their fundamental right- the person corrodes the nation’s system of values and rights. Every attempt and shortcut adds up eventually to create a society that functions based either elitism and subservience. I have no liking to difficulties- but I have no liking to encouraging elitism either.

A country is a summation of the thoughts and actions of each individual in that country- what action I take today defines what this nation will be tomorrow.

Coming closer to the sport of shooting. If excelling in sports is my attempt I would aim to win medals because I am amongst the most determined marksman in the range, in the city or state- not because the corroded system has removed the opportunity for more deserving individuals to shoot side by side with me.

I have no contempt for you for I have not been immune to thoughts of taking short cuts. I think about the shortcut to move to a country where individuals have the freedom to choose what they feel is right for them- where the right to defend themselves and their families is not a privilege granted by a member of parliament. The system frustrates me as much as it frustrates most people around me.

However, I respect your opinion and your entitlement to air it,
~Chandan

I appreciate your mature outlook towards the discussion.

Regards,
SS

[Vikram]

SS, Bravo!

[goodboy_mentor]

Well replied by SS in clear and precise thoughts. Nothing more needs to be said.

[Chandan22]

Hello,

That was very well put. I must say I understand where you're coming from. And while it may have appeared otherwise, I'm a very conformist person when it comes to the law and what is right, and hence your thoughts echo with me.

But

"For every weakness an individual shows, for every exception or shortcut an individual takes, for every attempt s/he makes to use political influence to get what is their fundamental right- the person corrodes the nation’s system of values and rights. Every attempt and shortcut adds up eventually to create a society that functions based either elitism and subservience. I have no liking to difficulties- but I have no liking to encouraging elitism either. "

Here I have a difference of opinion. Firstly I will admit that it was a selfish consideration. No doubting that. But putting that aside, from the idealistic perspective of what you state I see some more or less insurmountable hurdles.

1. The shortcut being thought about, as yet it was only a thought since I don't really have that kind of reach, was an outcome not of my low ideals but of the depths of the failure of the current system. And while I'm all for striving towards utopia, if the realistic probability of its achievement is not looking good in a particular domain, I would prefer to focus my energies on those areas where positive change can be bought. God knows there are lots of areas where our country and society need positive change.

2. While I do laud those who have faced and challenged difficulties in getting a licence, I don't see the system changing at this kind of scale of action. Unfortunately there are precious few who wish to acquire arms, and even lesser in this group who will go about challenging a rejection with passion and conviction. So bringing about a change is statistically speaking not possible with the current scheme of things. Even a huge public movement still hasn't gotten the lokpal going.. so some of us taking on the licencing department in delhi will certainly not bring about any change, and conversely not cause that great a harm to those coming after us either. And here, I doubt elitism is being propounded as such.


"Coming closer to the sport of shooting. If excelling in sports is my attempt I would aim to win medals because I am amongst the most determined marksman in the range, in the city or state- not because the corroded system has removed the opportunity for more deserving individuals to shoot side by side with me."

For a system where having to be a renowned shooter to get ammo to practise is mandatory, yet the law doesn't think how one can become a renowned shooter without having enough ammo to practise, sometimes the ends may justify the means, if the ends and means both don't inflict violence and harm upon other individuals. Yes you may debate that such a practise itself amounts to violence of ideals, but I can live with that.

Actually I'm sort of arguing for the sake of it... In my heart I'm with you...but we're unfortunately in a scenario where choosing to live by ideals is exceptionally difficult, frustrating and more often than not it means having to forego what you want because you will simply not have the energy, resources of even the will left over to continue fighting for the extended periods of time and endless hurdles which the system will throw at you. And hence the occassional temptation to succumb to shortcuts !!! Hell, I could not even enter the karni singh range when I tried going there the first time to enquire about stuff !! the guard at the gate turned me away and in absence of available information I had not option to to obey him when he said that was the rule !!!!

But all said and done, I appreciate your thoughts and the discussion felt good...hope to continue conversing, arguing and always also learning from you and the others around.

~Chandan