Tips on Pistol Shooting

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atulgupta1
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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by atulgupta1 » Tue Sep 11, 2012 3:59 pm

tirpassion wrote: I will be straight forward with you this time with an example...
Thanks Tir, I understand where you are coming from and I do realize I went over-board with my own expectations, particularly about the time-frame I set to achieve all this.
I am shooting since November 2006 and I am doing a serious effort to erase the accumulated errors recorded in my subconscious mind since last one and a half years now. So I wish that no one trains incorrectly and keep on recording errors.
I have done some deep thinking on what you have advised. I have come to realize that achievement to 100% is not a goal one can achieve in one go, and then assume it will stay with you. I now realize that it is a "process" and one needs to continuously work at maintaining a good level while keep correcting flaws & deviations. I will work on this.
- I am still working on my gripping. I have not achieved 100% as yet
- I am still working on my stance. I have not achieved 100% as yet. I am discovering the importance of the actions of the muscles to hold the skeletal structure in place during the position
- I am discovering the importance of the position of the head while in shooting stance and i HAVE UNDERSTOOD THAT IT HAS TO BE VERIFIED REGULARLY by a competent person.
In the absence of a good physical coach here, I think I will post my flaws to get advise from you, Dev & HVJ so that I can correct them.
I will humbly request you to please simplify things...I am afraid that you are going towards an excess...
Point taken.
I would suggest/request you to erase all the points of goals / objectives you have enumerated in your post...

I have given you a 6 weeks macro plan which is simple. I would rather love to read that you have already started the exercises and that you have fixed your natural alignment and that you have got your head position and your stance verified by a knowledgeable person etc.
I have already started the Box Drill exercises and am recording them in my diary. I have now revised my next 1-month plan / targets, based on your advise, as follows -

What I have already fixed / corrected to quite an extent:-

1. The AP Grip - Based on the advise given by HVJ, I worked on my wrist-lock on the AP. I soon realized that when I do the wrist-lock correctly and raise the pistol with my eyes closed, my AP barrel was pointing about 10-15 degrees higher than required. As a result, (in the past), I used to bend down my wrist to adjust the angle of the barrel, which was obviously unnatural & incorrect. I have now shaved off the plastic support of my Steyr LP10 (where the barrel rests on the wood), so the angle of the barrel is now more or less correct (maybe 2-3 degrees variation). I will fix that too when I get more accurate with my assessments. I also adjusted the grip base, so that the base support does not squeeze my little finger and palm rest like it used to. They are now comfortable and my palm no longer cups.

2. Wrist Lock - I am now able to make it a habit of locking my wrist when my pistol is touching the bench (45-degrees position) before I start to raise the pistol. It is working fairly well. With more practice, I will be able to improve this.

3. Trigger finger position - After reading the advise on this forum, I noticed that the trigger shoe used to touch the line dividing my last digit of trigger finger. My trigger finger also used to touch the grip of the AP - this resulted in jerks or snatches during trigger operation. Based on the advise by HVJ, I have now been able to shave a bit of the wooden grip and adjust my trigger finger position such that the trigger finger does not touch the grip and the center pad (flesh) of the last digit touches the center groove of the trigger shoe - very gently. I have done lot of self-talk, telling myself that the trigger shoe is actually my own eye-ball. I need to place my finger on it very gently and squeeze it slowly as if I'm squeezing my own eye-ball. The self-talk seems to have worked. My trigger squeeze operation is improving. The correct placement of my trigger finger on the shoe has now more or less become involuntary.

4. Arm & Pistol Alignment - I have practiced aligning my pistol barrel directly in the same line as my arm so that the recoil is passed directly to my shoulders to minimize any shake. I now practice this as a focus item, while raising the pistol to the target. Hopefully, with a lot of practice, I can improve it and also make it involuntary.

5. Front Sight Focus - Reading the advise on this forum, I realized how important it is to focus on the front sight of the pistol. I checked the lens of my blinder and it was set to focus on the target instead (my eyes are far-sighted). As a result, even if I tried to focus on the front sight, it used to appear blurred and involuntarily, my focus moved to the target. I had someone measure the distance between my eyes and the front sight when I'm holding the AP (36.5 inches) and then went to a good optician and had him make me a lens with the exact focus to my front sight. It is working much better now.

6. Sight Alignment Vs. pistol shot on the target - I felt that it is very important to set the SA of the AP accurately, such that when they are perfectly aligned, the shot should land in the exact center of the 10-ring. Otherwise, we keep adjusting the sights and end up aligning the shots with our gripping errors, SA errors, aiming area errors and other shooting errors, further casting our errors in our muscle memory. To correct this, I setup a vice on a stand in the shooting range at my house - at the height of my shooting position. I gripped the AP in it and then adjusted the shot in the center of the 10-ring. I then adjusted the SA of the pistol as it should be in the sub-6 position. I now know, that if the shot misses the center of 10 ring, the error is with my shooting and not the sight alignment of the pistol so I need to work on my shooting, not adjusting the sights.

What I need to work on in the next 1-month:

1. Sight Alignment (SA) practice - Box Drills
2. Figure "8" exercises - Box Drills
3. Front sight focus practice - Box Drills - Blank target practice
4. Aiming area hold - Box drills
5. Slow trigger squeeze operation - with eyes closed / eyes open - I'm doing 100 times per day already
6. Follow through - for 5 seconds each dry-fire - Box Drills

Please continue advising me and let me know if I'm on the right track.

Thanks

Atul

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atulgupta1
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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by atulgupta1 » Tue Sep 11, 2012 5:27 pm

Hi

I suspect I have a pellet velocity problem with my AP and I would like to solve it (at least so far I think it is a pellet velocity problem).

My Steyr LP10 pistol does not cut a clean hole in the target paper and somewhat 'tears' it like the shape of a comma ' , '.

In the Chandigarh state competitions, the rest of the shooters were getting a clean cut so I know the target paper is not the culprit as I was using the same target paper issued to me.

Since my AP is second hand, I think the previous owner fiddled with the velocity screws. How can I fix it to give me a 500 FPS pellet speed? (is 500 FPS correct?). I know how to adjust the pellet velocity in my Steyr, but do not want to touch it without knowledge, because if I simply crank up the speed, I may end up increasing the recoil unnecessarily.

I have heard of 'chrono' which help adjust the speeds but do not know what they are, how to use them or where to get one.

Please advise and help.

Atul

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by tirpassion » Tue Sep 11, 2012 6:07 pm

Atul,
5. Front Sight Focus - Reading the advise on this forum, I realized how important it is to focus on the front sight of the pistol. I checked the lens of my blinder and it was set to focus on the target instead (my eyes are far-sighted). As a result, even if I tried to focus on the front sight, it used to appear blurred and involuntarily, my focus moved to the target. I had someone measure the distance between my eyes and the front sight when I'm holding the AP (36.5 inches) and then went to a good optician and had him make me a lens with the exact focus to my front sight. It is working much better now.
Precisely not. You should never try to focus on the front sight. The SA image cut-out invented by Guruji is to programme our sub-conscious to see the SA image (the sleeping E) as a whole entity, together. Your mind should be so trained that you eye sees the Sight Alignment image together.
I was told by shooters who use glasses here that the ideal shooting glass is the one which lets you see both the target and the SA clearly. It should not have any particular point of focus. It should allow your eye to function as if you are using it naturally without glasses. There is an optician in Paris who is himself a shooter and hence a specialist on shooting glasses. Whosoever I know here has got his/her lens made by him. I do not wear any glasses as yet. I will get it confirmed and let you know.
6. Sight Alignment Vs. pistol shot on the target - I felt that it is very important to set the SA of the AP accurately, such that when they are perfectly aligned, the shot should land in the exact center of the 10-ring. Otherwise, we keep adjusting the sights and end up aligning the shots with our gripping errors, SA errors, aiming area errors and other shooting errors, further casting our errors in our muscle memory. To correct this, I setup a vice on a stand in the shooting range at my house - at the height of my shooting position. I gripped the AP in it and then adjusted the shot in the center of the 10-ring. I then adjusted the SA of the pistol as it should be in the sub-6 position. I now know, that if the shot misses the center of 10 ring, the error is with my shooting and not the sight alignment of the pistol so I need to work on my shooting, not adjusting the sights.
Please know also that your gripping will change as you will improve on it. Your aiming area will also be fine tuned with time. But to begin with it was a good idea.

Do not go for any further abrupt modifications of the grip without the physical guidance of a knowledgeable person. BTW why not earn your own experience? After all, I had gone through 2 grips on my LP10 and I am with my 3rd grip on my AP40 :D and this one is cosmetically intact since one year :lol: . I said cosmetically, because I have added weight to the grip (drilled holes, put in lead, sealed with wood paste and paint finished it to the point that the scar is hardly visible. A good cosmetic surgery, so to say)

Please let me know what box drills you have done and what is the % you have achieved. I would recall that one must work on ONE THING AT A TIME.

For the pellet velocity part, dev will be able to help you because he did it on his own LP10. Would you kindly help dev??

best regards
tirpassion

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by atulgupta1 » Tue Sep 11, 2012 7:12 pm

tirpassion wrote:
Precisely not. You should never try to focus on the front sight. The SA image cut-out invented by Guruji is to programme our sub-conscious to see the SA image (the sleeping E) as a whole entity, together. Your mind should be so trained that you eye sees the Sight Alignment image together.
I was told by shooters who use glasses here that the ideal shooting glass is the one which lets you see both the target and the SA clearly. It should not have any particular point of focus. It should allow your eye to function as if you are using it naturally without glasses. There is an optician in Paris who is himself a shooter and hence a specialist on shooting glasses. Whosoever I know here has got his/her lens made by him. I do not wear any glasses as yet. I will get it confirmed and let you know.
Hi Tir, I'm confused here now. All that I have read on AP shooting from experts, and advise from Guruji indicated that the focus needs to be on the front sight. I'd like Guruji to give me some clarity on the subject. However, I agree that the sleeping "E" SA image is good imprint on the mind.
Please let me know what box drills you have done and what is the % you have achieved. I would recall that one must work on ONE THING AT A TIME.
Yes, I'll send you the details soon.

BTW, the 20 shot I did today is attached below. Nothing short of a disaster. It is obvious I'll need to work very hard on my practice. Guruji, please guide me.

Atul
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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by tirpassion » Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:01 pm

There is nothing to be confused Atul,
Imagine yourself shooting with your focus firmly fixed on the front sight. Can you see the clear sharp image of the rear sight at the same time? I can not because if I focus on the front sight, the rear sight becomes blurred and vice versa. I believe that it is not only me but most of the human beings will function that way which is natural. So if you do not see the rear sight sharply will you be able to keep both the sights perfectly aligned? Then what can one do? The only solution is to programme the brain to see both the front and rear sight (sight alignment) sharply together. Hence the need of that famous SA image cut-out (the sleeping E) pasted everywhere at home.

best regards
tirpassion

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by tirpassion » Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:12 pm

Hey friends,
It suddenly flashed in my mind that it should be a real occasion for you all who are pariticipating in GFG to meet Guruji and seek his blessings this weekend!!!

Sir, would you visit Balewadi for the GFG meet?

Best regards
tirpassion

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by tirpassion » Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:19 pm

Tell me one thing dev,
Are you obliged to go through the Delhi States Comp to participate in the AIGVM? You must have attained the MQS earlier and it should be still valid no?
If you do not mind, i need to talk to you once for the Delhi States this week.
best regards
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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by dev » Wed Sep 12, 2012 4:54 pm

Hi Tir,

I checked with our Delhi State Head and he said that the score has to be shot every time. I have shot the score in the last Delhi State 365/400. Wish I had kept concentrating cause my 60 shot score suffered. 541/600. Please feel free to call or I will call you.

As far as adjusting the velocity of the LP 10 goes you tube has the video made by Steyr. A quick search will reveal the how to. On hindsight I think it is better to leave the LP 10 in the factory setting. On high power you need both the cylinders for a match. ( I change the moment it gets near the yellow mark). The shape of the tear on paper is also due to the paper quality at times or even the pellet.

The DSRA web site has all the dates of the competition, it starts from the 27 and ap is on all the three days. With Standard Pistol match being on the 30th.

Warm Regards,

Dev
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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by airgun_novice » Wed Sep 12, 2012 6:42 pm

Dear tirpassion, After wasting 3 precious days (Sep 9-11), I made it to the range today. As per your direction shot 9 pellets per card and such were 6. Incorporated Trigger Break too as suggested.
Achieved %SOA-TB = 36/54 =67% with the desired scores statistics 31/54 ~ 57% (#9s=15; #10s=16)

Then I changed the cylinders and went for a 60-shot match - after a good long break, since I had the time. 20 shots/ card - three cards. Did it without any BD. Desired shots 36/60 = 60% (#9s=21; #10s=15)

Not happy with myself. Found it tough to concentrate with all the mundane thoughts cropping up every now and then. Tomorrow will be a better day. Will practice F8 and DF at home late tonight before hitting the sac. Thank you for your guidance call yesterday. Tomorrow wish to give you a better feedback. :cheers:

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by dev » Thu Sep 13, 2012 4:52 pm

My dear pistolero's have you read about this?

http://targettalk.org/viewtopic.php?t=3 ... c75fd3ef62

The time is being cut down in ap to 75 mins from 105 mins.

So we better get semi-auto air pistols :lol:
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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by brihacharan » Thu Sep 13, 2012 6:06 pm

[quote="airgun_novice"]
Dear tirpassion,
After wasting 3 precious days (Sep 9-11), I made it to the range today. As per your direction shot 9 pellets per card and such were 6. Incorporated Trigger Break too as suggested.
Achieved %SOA-TB = 36/54 =67% with the desired scores statistics 31/54 ~ 57% (#9s=15; #10s=16)

Then I changed the cylinders and went for a 60-shot match - after a good long break, since I had the time. 20 shots/ card - three cards. Did it without any BD. Desired shots 36/60 = 60% (#9s=21; #10s=15)

Not happy with myself. Found it tough to concentrate with all the mundane thoughts cropping up every now and then. Tomorrow will be a better day.

Hi AGN / Tirpassion,
> Reading AGN's post to Tirpassion literally triggered something in me, resulting in the following....

HOW TO IMPROVE YOUR CONCENTRATION?
WHY IS IT IMPORTANT?

•Paying attention to what you are doing is one of the most important keys to success. If you are not able to hold your attention on one thing for some time, how can you accomplish anything?

•Successful people are able to focus their mind on their goals day and night, until they accomplish them, be it fame, power, self-improvement or meditation. How can you improve your ability to focus your mind on your goals, when there are so many things that distract your attention?

•Controlled attention is the act of coordinating all the faculties of the mind and directing their combined power to a given end. It is an act, which can be achieved only by the strictest sort of self-discipline.

•Learn to fix your attention on a given subject, for whatever length of time you choose. You will have learned the secret to power! This is concentration.

•Keep your mind on the things you want and off the things you don’t want!

TIPS TO IMPROVE CONCENTRATION

1.Never tell yourself you cannot concentrate. Telling yourself that you cannot concentrate only makes it more difficult. By doing so, you program your mind to lack concentration and attention.

2.Whenever you need to focus your mind, tell yourself over and over again that you can concentrate. Tell yourself that you can develop this ability. This is called “AUTO SUGGESTION”

3.Remember that in order to improve your concentration you need to train it, like any other skill. If now you cannot fix your mind on one subject for more than a few seconds, in time, if you persevere, you will be able to fix the mind on anything for a longer time.

4.If there is something that is distracting your attention, such as emotional problems or unresolved business problems, tell your mind that all these problems can wait for a little while, and that you will attend to them after you finish what you are doing.

5.If this does not help you, then write down on a piece of paper what problems you have to think about or solve. This will, to some extent, temporarily remove the problems from your mind.

6.Do one thing at a time. Jumping from one thing to another will only teach your mind to be inattentive and lose attention quickly, besides that this kind of mental restlessness can be tiring in the long run.

7.When you focus your attention on anything, be alert, and when you find yourself thinking on something else, try to stay patient, and bring your mind to the subject again and again.

8.Often, when you remember, try to fix your attention on whatever you happen to be doing at the moment.

9.Try writing down your task for the day. When you write down your ideas you automatically focus your full attention on them. Few if any of us can write one thought and think another at the same time. Thus a pencil and paper make excellent concentration tools.”

•I think the one lesson I have learned in life is that, there is no substitute for paying attention.
•Because “Where attention goes, energy flows and results show.”
•Achieving excellence is in the details. Give attention to the details and excellence will follow.”

Lastly when you arrive at the shooting range after a long drive / ride, negotiating bad traffic – Do not unpack your shooting gear in a hurry & get on to the range - Just chill out for a few moments – Avoid conversation with fellow shooters, if it can be done. Splash some cold water on your face. Relax and ease your muscles by swinging your arms / rotating your shoulders / touching your toes / twisting your hips gently / take a few deep breaths & exhale slowly.

Remember all the while “Keep Your Mind Calm” – Focus on what you have determined to achieve. Pick up your AP with utmost love & care, caress it, treat it with respect.

You have come to the range to score a “Perfect 10” – Let this thought flow from your mind, down to your neck, to your shoulders, on to your upper arm, along your forearm and all the way to your wrist & trigger finger and let it pass through the barrel straight on to the inner most circle on the target!

All this should happen in a seamless sequence………………. If this happens – You have done it!!!

Cheers
Briha

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by tirpassion » Thu Sep 13, 2012 6:57 pm

Dear dev and all,

I was told about the reduced time here in France last year. We will be working on this reduced time from this year in France. I understood earlier that the time was reduced by 15 minutes. Now, it is clear that 15 minutes will be put separately for preparation and sighting. But does sighting mean sighter shots? There is a doubt.

best regards
tirpassion

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by atulgupta1 » Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:51 pm

Hi Dev
As far as adjusting the velocity of the LP 10 goes you tube has the video made by Steyr. A quick search will reveal the how to. On hindsight I think it is better to leave the LP 10 in the factory setting. On high power you need both the cylinders for a match. ( I change the moment it gets near the yellow mark).
As I stated, I already know how to adjust the velocity (which screws to turn), I don't know how much to turn them. In the Steyr video, they use a fairly advanced machine, which I do not have. That is why I was asking about the 'Chronos'. I did not fiddle with the velocity on the AP myself but I guess the previous AP owner did.
The shape of the tear on paper is also due to the paper quality at times or even the pellet.
Like I stated, in the Chandigarh State competitions, other shooters we getting a clean cut on the same paper.

Hope you are able to guide me further based on above.

Regards,

Atul

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by tirpassion » Thu Sep 13, 2012 8:58 pm

Brihaji, you did it again.
If we need to keep on bending at all instances before you how will we ever walk straight or stand up in life? :D :D :D

Excellent explication SIR!
9.Try writing down your task for the day. When you write down your ideas you automatically focus your full attention on them. Few if any of us can write one thought and think another at the same time. Thus a pencil and paper make excellent concentration tools.”
Hence the importance of writing the Shooting diary. This is why the Shooting Diary is one of the most important instruments of Mental Training. Let us all understand it for good!

warm regards
tirpassion

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Re: Tips on Pistol Shooting

Post by airgun_novice » Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:47 am

airgun_novice wrote:[SNIP]Achieved %SOA-TB = 36/54 =67% with the desired scores statistics 31/54 ~ 57% (#9s=15; #10s=16)

Then I changed the cylinders and went for a 60-shot match - after a good long break, since I had the time. 20 shots/ card - three cards. Did it without any BD. Desired shots 36/60 = 60% (#9s=21; #10s=15)
[SNIP] Tomorrow wish to give you a better feedback. :cheers:
As decided with a "steely" resolve - only the steel turned out not to be wootz but SS :-( - went to the range today. Achieved %SOA-TB = 41/54 = 76% with the desired scores statistics 23/54 ~ 43 % (#9s=12; #10s=11) Something about the shot placement was not right - may be the stance or the cylinder was low; I could not pinpoint.

Followed by 20* 5 F8s for both RH & LH.

Then I changed the cylinders and went for a 40-shot match. 10 shots/ card - four cards. Did it without any BD. Desired shots 28/40 = 70% (#9s=14; #10s=14). Realized then that my FT was wanting. So shot a card of 17 shots just for the FT. Why 17 shots ? Dabba got emptied out. :-) Plus had spent around 3 hr and half at the range. Tomorrow - set AP for H&N and BD on FT plus of course the F8s etc. Shubh Ratri Uttam Nidra :ZZZ: for now.

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