COLT PISTOL USED BY SHRI CHANDRA SHEKHAR AZAD

[bishnoi29]

Hi Pran

If possible get some pic's of the pistol also.
We have to pay tribute to our freedom fighter's.

[essdee1972]

Hammerhead, most of the arms were obtained from police stations / vehicles, money was obtained from donations, looting British sympathisers, and govt pay trucks. There were some attempts by revolutionaries to get arms from abroad. Ref. the activities of Har Dayal in US during WW1, Rash Behari Bose in Japan / SE Asia in the same period upto WW2, etc. Most of the attempts failed due to the superb (to give them their due) intelligence run by the Indian Political Service. For reference to Indian Political Service training and (only slightly exaggerated) activities, refer "Kim", by Kipling.

Timmy, there's a book called "On Secret Service, East of Constantinople", which gives the details of "Drang nacht Osten" (Drive to the East) - German / Turkish penetration attempts into India via Persia and Afghanistan, in an attempt to rouse Indian Nationalists to overthrow the Raj. This book is written from a British perspective (although quite fairly, with no attempts to belittle Germans / Turks (except the Pashas!) / Indians), . The story is basically the truth behind the novel "Greenmantle" by John Buchan (who also wrote "The Thirty-Nine Steps", made into a successful film by Hitchcock). Pretty thrilling!

[icemanV]

I am now even more proud to be having one in my family's posession.

Nice nice 3 cheers.

[Hammerhead]

Hammerhead, most of the arms were obtained from police stations / vehicles, money was obtained from donations, looting British sympathisers, and govt pay trucks. There were some attempts by revolutionaries to get arms from abroad. Ref. the activities of Har Dayal in US during WW1, Rash Behari Bose in Japan / SE Asia in the

Thanks , my family lived through all that and we lost half of our property to RAJ and both my grand fathers ( mom's and dad's ) spend years and years in many jails over the time . And all my family uncles fought in 62,65,71 and so on ,that's where you learn first gun ownership and " Take a stand now , or there will be no grounds to stand " thing

I know all but my point is still same that the police in that time and now "Do not carry .32ACP". How and why they choose to carry this minion gun when they could have bigger calibers and fight to live other day - Haji

[essdee1972]

Hammerhead, 0.32 might (just might.... my theory!) have been taken from a British sympathiser civilian. One, it's NPB, hence as you say, probably a civilian arm; and two, mostly pro-Raj people had guns back then. Also, probably some of the smuggled arms did get through in spite of efforts by the security men (who were mostly trying to stop the bigger consignments). One way to find out is to get the serial number and try Colt archives for info on that. Doubt that anyone in the govt would be interested! (seeing their attitude towards the gun wielding freedom fighters since '47)

My Uncle and grand Uncle who were with Surya Sen in Chittagong in those days did mention that they used "small" pistols for ease of concealment, as most of them wore dhotis and could stick the gun in the waist, without having the dhoti unravel (one guy was actually caught when his gun slipped out from his dhoti - ref "Do and Die" by Manini Sen). If they mentioned the bore ever, I seem to have forgotten.

On the other hand, I have read elsewhere (don't remember the source) that Azad had a Mauser - the bolt action WW1 German officer issue type. That of course, would require a full size holster and sling due to the sheer size.

Well, whatever gun Azad, Bhagat Singh, and all those guys used, the fact remains that they were heroes, who have not been given their due by the Govt. The title of the movie on Subhas Chandra Bose - "Bose, the Forgotten Hero" (Timmy, another one for you) - is very apt, and can be applied to all the gun-wielding heroes of our struggle for freedom!

[Sakobav]

Revolutionaries didnt have much money and procuring weapons and ammo required connections since none was being smuggled in.
Also these folks were really very very young without any training but they compensated greatly by their will and drive and desire. Their Life spam was hardly more than 5 years before being caught or they had to escape /exile.

All of the soldiers returning from war were rarely allowed to carry back their war trophies. There was only one effort part of Hindu-German Conspiracy wherein Germans ( San Francisco Attache Fran Von Papen later Chancellor of Germany) via Gahdars in US coordinated shipping of consignment of arms to Bagha Jatin et al in Orissa. British had already infiltrated the Ghadar movement and most of these revolutionaries were caught - Kartar Singh Sarabha, Pingle et al.

We do have a member here whose great grand uncle was part of this movement.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindu%E2%8 ... Conspiracy

"In the United States, an elaborate plan and arrangement was made to ship arms from the country and from the Far East through Shanghai, Batavia, Bangkok and Burma.[49] Even while Herambalal Gupta was on his mission in China and Japan, other plans were explored to ship arms from the United States and East Asia. The German high command decided early on that assistance to the Indian groups would be pointless unless given on a substantial scale.[55] In October 1914, German Vice Consul E.H von Schack in San Francisco approved the arrangements for funds and armaments. $200,000 worth of small arms and ammunition were acquired by the German military attaché Captain Franz von Papen through Krupp agents, and arranged for its shipment to India through San Diego, Java, and Burma. The arsenal included 8,080 Springfield rifles of Spanish-American War vintage, 2,400 Springfield carbines, 410 Hotchkiss repeating rifles, 4,000,000 cartridges, 500 Colt revolvers with 100,000 cartridges, and 250 Mauser pistols along with ammunition.[55] The schooner Annie Larsen and the sailing ship SS Henry S were hired to ship the arms out of the United States and transfer it to the SS Maverick. The ownership of ships were hidden under a massive smokescreen involving fake companies and oil business in south-east Asia. For the arms shipment itself, a successful cover was set up to lead British agents to believe that the arms were for the warring factions of the Mexican Civil War.[2][47][56][57][58][59][60] This ruse was successful enough that the rival Villa faction offered $15,000 to divert the shipment to a Villa-controlled port.[2]

[TwoRivers]

On the other hand, I have read elsewhere (don't remember the source) that Azad had a Mauser - the bolt action WW1 German officer issue type. That of course, would require a full size holster and sling due to the sheer size.

!

Now that would be a strange gun; a pistol with a bolt and requiring both holster and sling. Mauser pocket pistols in .32 ACP were carried by many German officers. The only "issue" Mauser pistol in German service in WW1 was the Mauser "broomhandle" in caliber 9mm Parabellum. A cartridge surely not common in India at that time.

[TwoRivers]

"
The arsenal included 8,080 Springfield rifles of Spanish-American War vintage, 2,400 Springfield carbines, 410 Hotchkiss repeating rifles, 4,000,000 cartridges, 500 Colt revolvers with 100,000 cartridges, and 250 Mauser pistols along with ammunition.[55] The schooner Annie Larsen and the sailing ship SS Henry S were hired to ship the arms out of the United States and transfer it to the SS Maverick. The ownership of ships were hidden under a massive smokescreen involving fake companies and oil business in south-east Asia. For the arms shipment itself, a successful cover was set up to lead British agents to believe that the arms were for the warring factions of the Mexican Civil War.[2][47][56][57][58][59][60] This ruse was successful enough that the rival Villa faction offered $15,000 to divert the shipment to a Villa-controlled port.[2]

At best, these "Springfield" 'rifles would have been Krag-Jorgensen rifles and carbines in caliber .30-40, just as likely trapdoor single-shots in .45-70. There never was a "Springfield" .30-06 carbine.

[lazybones]

Mauser pistols were floating around Calcutta around 1915. Broomhandle or pocket pistol I cannot say. In the famous Rodda Arms Case 50 Mauser pistols and 50,000 rounds of ammo were looted from the Calcutta gunshop of Rodda and Company http://www.indiankanoon.org/doc/568638/

By the time I was a gun crazy tyke in shorts, Rodda and Co had become a dealer in "Sanitary fittings". The first floor had a discreet gunsmithing section for old customers All that remained of the old legacy was a mini cannon in brass that was used as a door stopper. It's probably still there today.

Ashok

[pran80]

Dear IFGians,
Reviving this thread as I was reading a book on martyr Chadrashekhar Azad by his comrade in arms Vishvanath Viashampayan the title of the book is " Amar Shaheed Chandrashekhar Azad" published by Rajkamal Prakashan, ISBN 978-81-267-1453-3. On page 196-197 Vaishampayan gives a glimpse of the source of the gun. The book is in hindi I have tried to translate the text below -

The revolutionaries used to get guns from Jaipur as well, the person facilitating this trade was Vaidya Sh. Muktinarayan Shukla who had an agency of Jhandu Pharmacy in Jaipur apart from producing medicines using the Jaipur Estates Laboratory. It was during the course of his working there that he got acquainted with the armoury officers who used to sell the weapons and ammunition for money which were then sold to the revolutionaries. Muktinarayan Shukla during a meeting with the author in 1966 claimed that the pistol with Azad during his last battle with British Police was infact supplied by him. He got this pistol from former commander in chief of Alwar Estate Ganga Singh who had gifted it to him alongwith a deed of gift as he had cured his wife of some disease.
Another claim on the pistol's origin is by Vidyabhushan Shukla who said that the pistol with Azad during his last battle belonged to Prof. Bannerji.
I tried researching on Vidyabhushan and Prof. bannerji but could not gather any information. I hope better informed members here will be able to shed more light on the topic.
thanks,
Pranjal

[TC]

Thank you so much Pranjal. This is indeed very interesting and throws a new light. Wondering who Prof. Banerji might be.

TC

[Sakobav]

Sometimes the guns were taken from family members Like Prem Khanna Kakori train robbery patriot who had his fathers Mauser broom pistol. He was caught and pistol traced and flagged because of excessive ammo also being bought against the license.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prem_Krishna_Khanna

There was another Maulana Muslim leader from Aligarh who earlier in his career supplied guns ammo and money to Azad's group. Isnt it strange that Turkey has a whole town and univ named after Ram Chander Bismil..These freedom fighters are all forgotten because the subsequent Indian regimes always had their own agenda..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bismil
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ram_Prasad_Bismil

[TC]

Sometimes the guns were taken from family members Like Prem Khanna Kakori train robbery patriot who had his fathers Mauser broom pistol. He was caught and pistol traced and flagged because of excessive ammo also being bought against the license.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prem_Krishna_Khanna

There was another Maulana Muslim leader from Aligarh who earlier in his career supplied guns ammo and money to Azad's group. Isnt it strange that Turkey has a whole town and univ named after Ram Chander Bismil..These freedom fighters are all forgotten because the subsequent Indian regimes always had their own agenda..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bismil
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ram_Prasad_Bismil

TC

[Armed Defence]

Salute to Chandara Shekhar Azad and all other heroes who fought and died for us. I liked this post very much gained a lot of knowledge; thanks for it. Now, my few cents about the topic. Someone mentioned that the range of the pistol used was 25-30 and then another brother said that the distance between Azad ji and the policemen was more than 25-30 yards. It is my personal experience that the actual range of a handgun is more than the effective range mentioned by the manufacturer.