Indians For Guns

Will be in Indore (BSF grounds) this December.

I do not know the exact dates yet.

Mack The Knife

Mack The Knife,
Are you planning a trip ? Big Bore any one?
Axx

And what do I use?

To hire a rifle and ammo for one round costs anywhere from Rs.40,000 to Rs.50,000 from certain private parties and Rs.10,000 + if hiring from the cops. I don't have that type of money to burn, especially when there are very strong and repeated rumours about the renowned shot places being rigged for Rs.50,000 per certificate (three/four year old price, incidentally) . That is, you shoot away from the target and the chap in the butts punches your targets. Sound's familiar, Asif? I am told this happened in your time as well.

Sorry to digress but this really gets my goat.

Mack The Knife

Mack The Knife,

What kind of rifles do people use at the Indian 300m matches? This is a sport that the benchresters have heavily got into and equipment and ammo is very, very expensive, advanced, and high tech thanks to the benchresters participation, though the sport is still restricted by the ISSF's prehistoric rules carved on stone tablets. Grunig Elmiger, Bleiker, Tanner etc are now chambering advanced benchrest rounds in their 300m rifles like the 6x47 Swiss Match, 6.5x47 Lapua and what is probably the most efficient of the new rounds, the US designed and Norma manufactured 6mm XC. And, as the sport races ahead, you are bound to see more and more benchrest tech being used - who knows? 308 Baer and similar rifles in the future may find themselves in 300m rifles, especially for the police and service CISM matches.

I cannot imagine Indian laws allowing Indian participants to change guns every year, or to allow shooters to get their rifles rebarreled every six months as would be ideal with barrel burning high pressure rounds like these, the old 6mm PPC, 6mm BR etc. Just wondering...

Mehul

Mehul,
I last dropped out out guns around the time 6mm PPC was new.I do Remember that one of the designers was a doctor.Must catch up on this-any good sites ?
Mack The Knife-
There were vague rumours etc but to think it really happened and is in vogue is a shocker and a shame.
The prices also seem to be a killer-the sport of the vaunted few...
Goat seems to be too mild - put them up against the wall and shoot em.I am mad!
Axx

What kind of rifles do people use at the Indian 300m matches?

Mehul, I do not know for certain as I haven't attended such a match and Bangalore does not have a 300m range that is open to civilians.

However, if I were to hazard a guess I would say .303/7.62 Lee Enfields, 7.62mm SLR's (in single shot mode), perhaps a smattering of IOF .315s and then there maybe privately owned rifles in .270 Win., .308, .30-06, etc.. Calibre should not exceed 8mm though. Another reason why I did not buy that Coggie in .375 H&H Mag - which incidentally, is how we met on the net via Old Sarge.

Mack The Knife

Asif,

The 6mm PPC designed by Dr Lou Palmisano and Ferris Pindell is little more than an Americanised round based on the case from the 5.54x39.5mm Russian service round. It is a 1970s development, though, typically, benchrest tech takes about ten years to filter into ISSF and other competition. The newer developments have been filtering faster into ISSF CISM matches because of the Swiss and the US Army Marksmanship Unit which are determined to make the gold a sort of national monopoly for their respective countries.

Mack The Knife,

All of the choices that you have suggested are very sad ones. One of the tricks in this kind of shooting, especially when you are restricted by weight, is to use a round with minimum recoil and bullets which are highly streamlined so that they deviate as little as possible due to wind or any other extraneous factor. The 270, 30-06 etc are simply too heavy in recoil for this precision application and the SLRs are not quite the precision tools that some of the guns used outside India are. Very sad - I wonder why the NRAI Lords that Be don;t try and encourage this sport as well... I need to run now before I get accused of another anti NRAI prejudice!

Mehul

I wonder why the NRAI Lords that Be don;t try and encourage this sport as well.

I wouldn't put the complete blame on the NRAI. Not their fault that three hundred metre ranges, for civilians, are few and far between and that equipment for such an event is very difficult and expensive to come by. That is the central government's fault.

Sure, they should keep lobbying for the removal of restrictions on arms and ammo and push the State Associations in accuiring land for 300 m ranges. Easier said than done though, considering land prices in urban India. Ofcourse, there is no question of having 300 metre ranges if sufficient people do not have the necessary equipment. Ergo, that ban needs to be reversed first.

Mack The Knife

Confirmed dates for 300 metre Big Bore are 17th to 25th January at MHOW.

Mack The Knife

Mack The Knife,

What sort of target is used in the 300mtr big bore shooting?I believe there are 2 categories,3 position and prone.Are the targets the same for all categories? What sort of scores are required to get into the top 25 ranking.I think you understand the reason why I am asking these questions I generally shoot for fun and don't bother about scores.Infact most of the times I shoot at cans or bottles or at targets of human cutouts(what the police uses)

penpusher

I think you understand the reason why I am asking these questions.

Only too well because I have wanted to do it for the same reason.

What sort of target is used in the 300mtr big bore shooting?

The following picture is taken from the ISSF Rule Book - 2001 Edition.
Yes, the targets remain the same.

I believe there are 2 categories,3 position and prone.

The following is from the NRAI Match Book - 2001.











I have no idea what scores the top 25 have been getting but the MQS for men is 500 in Prone and 450 in 3P.


Hope this helps.

Mack The Knife

Mack The Knife,
That's incredible Such huge amount to hire guns and what goes on in the butts Shooting must be really an expensive sport , no let me rephrase that, hobby in India.

Hell mate, you better come here and we will camp at Bisley for a whole week and you can shoot all my guns to your heart's content - and there's quite a collection now and I have enough ammo to start a small war BTW, Bisley have come with electronic targets, so no need to hire butt markers either.

I really feel for you guys.

Krish

Thanks, Krish.

I'd love to do that and more.

Mack The Knife

How many of our members are participating at the GVM matches?

A roll call, please...

Thanks Mack The Knife.Any idea about from where I can get a current copy of the rule book?

penpusher

PS-Mack The Knife,if certain things develope the way I expect them to,in the next couple of months,I think I would be able to arrange for a rifle for you at the next nationals.