Page 1 of 1

Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro, IR

Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 8:44 pm
by airgun_novice
Dear all,

Sharing my experience with Air India/ Delhi Metro/ Indian Railways while carrying Air Pistol in public interest. As much as I would like to promote these modes of conveyance, I must confess I received neither free nor preferential treatment on any of these nor am I in employ of them. Nor am I in sinister cahoots with any of the Indo-German products that I am about to mention.

NOV 7: Flew AI *domestic* sector flight to Delhi from Mumbai. Carried my FWB P34 in its case with 3 tins (500 ct) of RWS R-10, Mastershot, gsmith & P-10 plus the accessories. I had my DRS pump neatly wrapped in a Sholapuri chadder as well. At Mumbai I was given boarding pass and the girl was about to pass on my bag when I reminded her that she needs to call security since I had made the declaration. Mind you the bag was scanned before I entered the terminal. So she called a security guy who escorted me and the bag to another corner where I opened the bag and took out the case with was in another shoulder rucksack. I explained various accessories and then pointe dout that I had chained the handles together and locked it since the latches did not have any loop. (Older FWB AP hard case). The security asked me if I needed to make any payment, and I explained that APs & their pellets are exempt as they do not come under hazardous materials. "So what do we see?" was their question to which I replied:
1. Both/ all the cylinders must be TOTALLY emptied
2. Cylinder must be detached from the AP to prevent any accidental firing due to some residual air
3. Pellets are PELLETS & not bullets
4. The case is securedly locked to prevent any *unintentional* opening
Additionally,
5. My letter from my club giving details of my AP with its serial # which must be verified and noted along with my address
6. Printout of GVM notice with paid receipt to MRA which tantamounts to "invitation"
7. Shooter's card (which obviously I did not have) - I showed my range's Life Membership card.
Needless to say they were all impressed and noted down the details of my AP and my address etc. and wished me luck.
All that took less than 10 minutes and ZERO rupees in fees and I was on my way.

NOV 8: Family was flying in this day and I also had to do my Weapon Control at Tughjlagabad. So I checked out of my motel at Aerocity and hailed a taxi for Tughlagabad since Aerocity Metro link is dysfunctional. After WC was done was dropped off at Vishnupuri Delhi Metro station. At the scanning counter, I declared I was carrying an AP and showed them all the paperwork PLUS the weapon control paper and shooter's card and all the details were duly noted and I was allowed through. No problems except the size and the weight of the bag which I was carrying but I had retained the AI tags and stamps. The rush was terrible and since I ahd to get to the hotel at Karol Baug had to change three trains - Govindpuripuri to Central Secretariat to Rajiv Chowk to Dwarka Extension. But once the security was done at Govindpuri did not have to re-check again. I got off at Jhandewalan without any incident or FEES. Score = 1-0

Nov 10: Detail was this day. I walked to Jhandewalan from Hotel Southern and declared with the security. "NO" was the answer. I reasoned that he could check what I was carrying and that it's allowed in Delhi metros plus I had the paperwork to support. "NO - my supervisor is not here. Even I am not supposed to carry my *machine-gun* and its bullets. He was holding an INSAS." I did not argue any more and walked down and back again. Huge Hanuman was smiling down upon me from the other side. I chose to hail an auto now. That ride was a totally grand experience; but I shall refrain from writing it. In short carrying AP in Delhi metro was a bummer. Score = 1-1.

After our respectrive matches spent a quality time with a friend and a Delhi based AP shooter who is an IFGian in the CR Park area and was then dropped off at Nehru Place metro station. Declared and everything was checked and noted and allowed through. One of the junior 'afsaraan' was in his 20s and confessed that he is an avid shooter too - "lekin air rifle se kartaa hoon saabji". I wished him well and was on my way to the 3-train journey to Karol Baug. Score = 2-1.

Nov 11: @ NDLS. Family et al catching early morning train to Chandigadh. At the railway station, the security person was actually DOZING !!! :shock: While some of those in front of us just walked by without even putting their bags on conveyor belt, I went from saying to shouting "Excuse Me" ignoring 'advices' of "Oye jaldi". Finally the security who was standing at the door came by and woke his partner up. I declared but either they did not understand what I was saying or were in no mood. But both wanted to get back to their respectives positions as fast as possible and passed my bag through. NO HASSLES - NO FEES. Score = 3-1.

Nov 12: @Chandigadh. We checked out of the hotel and did some sight-seeing. Finally caught the evening train to Amritsar. No security check. But Railway Police did patrol the CC compartment. No questions asked - no checks performed - no words exchanged. Draw. Score = 3-1.

Nov 14: @Amritsar. Caught even earlier train to NDLS. No security checks. Draw. Score = 3-1.
Caught a cab to IGI - Terminal 3 since the return was an AI flight. Delhi roads were surprisingly empty and the run from NDLS to IGI took less than 30 minutes !!! Wife was of the opinion that we should not stop for lunch etc. but gobble something at the airport and if possible try to catch the earlier flight - if AI allowed. So we reached VERY EARLY but "technically" late to get on the 1300 flight since I was carrying the AP. After that AI-102 was announced but the seurity took another 3 hours to attend to my request. I kept returning to the counter for passes but was denied. Then I made a "mandavli" - "Why is your security guy not shwoing up ? I don't want my family sitting separately in the flight simply because your dudes do not do their duty. Seats are filling up fast. Issue the boarding passes but hold on to the bags. Send them on only after security clears, what say ?" Finally at around 1545 (ONE HOUR BEFORE THE ETD !!!) the security guy shows up and takes me to another side of "oversized luggage". His superior was more "friendly" and told me how he applied same set of rules to a BJP leader from Mumbai etc. etc. I heard him out and then started on my own set of questions both praising and cornering him. Finally he said that this being an INTERNATIONAL SECTOR flight from US different set of rules apply ! Fine - I told him I have flown this very flight 'hazaar' times when I lived in the US for around 11 years - that impressed him. Also the flight would now be flying in the domestic sector - DELHI -MUMBAI. So why would US/ UK have any problem ? I assured him that I have no probs with his security procedures as long as he does it in time and gets us on that flight. This time a triplicate set of forms was filled in with all the details including my range address and also the details of the person who would carry the bag to the plane. We were the last folks to get on the flight. Anyway after a hard fought match the goal was in our favor. NO FEES. Final Score = 4-1.

The flight landed at Mumbai around 1915. We got our baggage around 2100 - the last to come out. Two security guys who were loitering there walked to me before I touched my bag and checked me out and asked me to check out my "samaan" and sign the form, which I did. The belt was halted a couple of times making us wonder if the bags were put on the flight in the first place. The "ladies compartment" was in panic mode - but I stayed cool and collected; something my wife appreciated in me on the way home. (Yup - one of the rare treats these days ;-) ). But that's what the fine sport of (pistol) shooting makes you. :-) So instead of being a passive reader take up shooting...

Hope my 2 cents worth of contribution here proves helpful and is put to right use. Safe shooting. Happy shooting. :cheers:

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 12:01 pm
by SriramK
Amazing how lax security is at places, and how uninformed and stubborn it is at others. Glad to hear that everything worked out fine :)

I try not to blame government officials/offices/setup, but they sure put up a hard battle with our patience :)

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 12:11 pm
by renjith747
Thanks a lot for the information...

Regards
Renjith.

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 12:13 pm
by fantumfan2003
Now that is one boy scout you are AGN..............

M.

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 12:22 pm
by airgun_novice
Thank you guys, Sriram, Renjith, FF. Notice I did not note down the first "goal"(flight to Delhi) - since that is the way it should have been. :-)

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:33 am
by shiv
Hey airgun_novice thanks for sharing your experience !

I did not face any problem when I came to delhi from cochin for the GVM Championship this month..

I was also carrying my friends AP to Delhi and back

The AI staff at Cochin International terminal was very help full and did everything in record time.... I just said that I needed 2 APs as I was competing in 2 diffrent events!

Gave them the letters from the secretary and showed them my certificates...they did not even ask for the Shooter ID cards.(as the secretary's letter already had my photo on it)

In delhi the AI security staff was waiting with our guns when we reached the baggage belt area, they asked us to check the boxes(which was slightly wet from the rain but otherwise ok)

From delhi to cochin I was traveling with two other friends, so we had 4 APs in all. we went to the Airport really early.. our flight was at 6.00 am from the int terminal of IGI, as one of our shooters was denied boarding the previous day as he came only 1.5 hours before the flight.

The AI counters opened at 2.30 am, I met the officer in charge and he instructed the counter staff to issue us the boarding pass but to tag & weigh our bags containing the guns and have it cleared by the security guys when they report for duty at 4.00 am.
( the AI staff mentioned that 3 people and 4 guns but the officer in charge said its for competition and we are not going to get any money so don't bother)
The staff (cute girl i must say :)) also cleared our exes baggage of 9kgs ( Diwali sweets and toys for my sons) without charging anything!

The security guys came at 4.00am and collected the letters which had all the details of our guns on it and also had us mention the flight no, the baggage tag nos and our mobile nos. once all this was done the AI porter along with the security staff took our bags and had it X-ray screened by the IGI airport staff and had our details entered in their register and we were free to go.

Also they had issue the weapon declaration forms fully completed to me both times.

Once in Cochin our bags came by the belt..we collected them n home sweet home!!!
this was my experience with Air India.

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:46 pm
by airgun_novice
That's wonderful experience, Shiv. Wish they will treat us all consistently like that. Do you know if your return AI flight was an international one or domestic ? Our return was a few days after the competition got over since we spent a few more days touring in North India. BTW," 2 APs for TWO competitions" ?? I really love that one :-) You should have gone with "One for NR and the other for ISSF" - they would have been impressed even more. ;-)

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:54 pm
by tirpassion
agn bhai,
it was also in my list of questions; how was your trip with AP in AI? But with time and age I tend to forget things :D .
Thanks for the nice write-up.
tirpassion

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:48 am
by essdee1972
AGN, good on you and your patience. One issue I have here with our officialdom. Especially for air travel.

If you are packing your (air)gun in checked luggage, and you have the documents to show that you have purchased it legally, and you have complied with safety stuff like unloading, decocking / removing cylinder, etc. (first four items under NOV 7 in AGN's post), why do they need shooter's card, range membership, etc. etc. If you can legally purchase an airgun without all these paperwork anywhere in the country, if you can carry it anywhere in the country without forms in triplicate, why do you need such stuff when transferring it?

Suppose I need to travel, for whatever reason, by air, with my 0.22. Now 0.22's are not recognised for sport purposes by any club (another imposition, IMHO), so no paperwork, except the purchase invoice. So what happens? Palm grease? Of course, isn't that the reason for most of our laws! And which is why "important politicians" were mentioned to AGN!

Even with firearms, you should only need to show that the particular piece belongs to you legitimately, you have a valid license both for the place you are boarding from and the place you are travelling to, and for the caliber (bore) / type of firearm you have.

Anything more than that is an imposition of babudom and, can I say, and assault on our rights?

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:48 pm
by airgun_novice
Agreed, essdeee1972. Extending the same logic - why should I even carry bills/ receipts/ POs ? If I were to wear a Rolex and fly Mumbai-Delhi is that a stipulation ? Compare the price of the Rolex with that of a .22 Indian AR. If the officials suspect anything's stolen they can cross-check against a DB of serial #s otherwise it's outside their jurisdiction anyway.

How can even firearms come under hazardous materials ? Does one need to undergo HazMat course to handle, say a S&W ? Does one need to have a HazMat license first before applying for a firearm license ? No. The rules are created vague and then there is no accountability in the enforcement circles so it's that individual's (or his boss') interpretation.

Now hasn't SC order on sun-block films on cars opened doors to the RTOs to usurp money along with the films ? Does the judgement say that should the cops be incompetent or under-equipped (no lux-meter as always) then the car-driver is NOT GUILTY and be allowed off. After all, does not "our" law say that let a 1000 criminals get off scott-free but not one innocent be punished ? :-) And on what criterion has the SC determined a small section of our society to be "VIP" and excused them conditionally from its judgement ? If SC takes such stands and metes out judgements, ordinary mortals like us can not hope for parity.

Re: Personal Experience with Air Pistol on AI, Delhi Metro,

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:59 pm
by AbbasRiz
airgun_novice wrote:

Now hasn't SC order on sun-block films on cars opened doors to the RTOs to usurp money along with the films ? Does the judgement say that should the cops be incompetent or under-equipped (no lux-meter as always) then the car-driver is NOT GUILTY and be allowed off. After all, does not "our" law say that let a 1000 criminals get off scott-free but not one innocent be punished ? :-)
A real eye-opening example, dear AGN !
Without suitable inspection kits, how are those fat-bellied cops going to decide whether the sun-block film has 70% transparency or not?
Regards,
Abbas