Indians For Guns

Guards foil car theft, kill one in shootout

NEW DELHI: In a scene straight out of a movie, two private guards - one of them an ex-armyman - on duty outside a jewellery showroom engaged in a gunbattle with five men who were trying to steal an SUV used to transport gold ornaments and diamonds from the showroom. One of the five men was killed during the battle.

According to the police, the two guards - Kishan and Lalit Kumar - initially tried shooting at the car's tyres to stop the accused from fleeing with the SUV. "Kishan, an ex-soldier, used his .12 bore rifle to try and hit the tyres but his shots hit the car. Lalit then fired at the temple of the robber driving the stolen car even as it moved 20 metres. The yet to be identified robber died on the spot. The others, who had arrived in another Bolero, fled. We are yet to identify the deceased and even the gang,'' said Tejinder Luthra, joint CP (northern range).

complete article available here http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 828827.cms

One less criminal to worry about. 12 bore rifle

Good show.
I hope they don't book the guards for murder.
There was one story I read on IFG where a doctor in Hydrabad was booked when he shot dead a thief with his shotgun. Wonder what happened in that case.

friends,
these gaurds should be honored.this incident should intimidate the thugs in future.
hope the gaurds are not prosecuted.
regards
dr.jk

Poor guards they would be in deep trouble.....a few years back a bank near to my office was being robbed in broad daylight ..the guard opened fire to save the cashier and as a result the robber died and two escaped. Last when I heard the guard was still behind bars.

Establised law is force used should be enough to thwart the threat to life & no more. In the given case the force used seems to be excesive. God help the the guard.

Rgds,
Biren

They were being shot at and they fired back. How is the force excessive? The threat was equal, firearm versus firearm and the guards are duty bound to protect the jewellers. I say we should pay their lawyers fee or find a good lawyer to help them pro bono. I am amazed that the second guard could use a shotty so accurately, guess this has more to do with the journalists writing.

.It is highly inappropriate to speculate on the outcome of the judicial process.Sec-96 to Sec.105 of the Indian Penal Code gives enough right of self defence. This covers both protection of life and property of the citizens. In this particular case, according to press reports enough restraint has been shown by both the guards, but at the end fatal injury had to be causes. The 12 bore rifle should be read as 12 bore short gun. It has got misreported due to lack of knowledge of the reporter.
For your general information, all armed private security guards are required to follow a certain procedure in handling such situations before they are to open fire. I do not fully agree with the rules of engagement laid down by the authorities, at least here in Noida and Greater Noida, but this is perhaps not the right post to discuss the issue.

One should not get carried away by the misleading information often circulated regarding consequence of retaliation in self defence. I strongly urge the members to go though the relevant provisions of the Indian Penal Code (which is also available on the internet) before speculating on the likely consequences that may befall on the two security guards.

Lastly ,I beg to differ from Shri Biren's assessment of threat posed by the robbers.It is reported that
one robber opened fire but missed. According to establised judicial pronouncements, the very fact that the opponent has drawn his gun , not to speak of opening fire is sufficient ground to kill him. A close reading of the legal provisions will indicate that when a reasonable apprehension of getting killed has arisen, a citizen has the right to kill the opponent. In such cases, there is no time to measure the threat very precisely or to give the opponent another chace to fire again and wait to see whether he is able to hit the target.

Dear Biren,

How can we ever determine the use of force excessive in defending?. I may not be equally strong as a theif with a knife trying to steal my house, I certainly would not like to pick up a knife in defence. Where is the line drawn, can somebody throw light on the matter.

regards,
drifter.

Very interesting exchange.
In the Indian context, it is very important to understand the law on self defence shooting

Hi,
Vernacular media has reported that one guard had a 12 bore gun and the second had a .315 Rifle. The killed robbber was hit by .315 Rifle bullet. Joint Comissioner of Police has said that both the guards will be felicitated. Below is the link on the same from NavBharat Times(hindi newspaper). I think there is some option in the site itself where you can read the news in english as well but i was unable to work it out.

http://navbharattimes.indiatimes.com/we ... 823756.cms

Regards,

Pranjal

I agree with indiaone. Guards did a legally good job they are supposed to do. As per news report the guards fired when their own life was under danger. If one reads the news item completely, one will find that an FIR (No. 144/12) under IPC Sections 392, 397, 307, 411, 34 has been registered at the Maurya Enclave police station. If one looks up these Sections of IPC in internet, will find that all these sections are invoked against the robbers.

The guards did a great job. And going by experience I would say they are lucky. Many people have been booked in the past for trying to save lives. We have a law that says lethal force can be used to defend life and property and we also have an administration governed by babus who interpret the same law to suit their convenience.
Goodboy_mentor you did a great job by digging out details of the FIR.

TC

Yes guards are double lucky. First they are alive, second cops didnt booked them. Robbery was attempted by Criminal elements from mewat. So cops & ppl have no sympaties towards them.

Just imagine if cops would have said "look guys those goons forecfully drove a vechicle away.. they fired & then you fired after that they drove away.....& you opened fire taking a head shot killing one.. excessive force, now you instead of taking law in your hand, should have called PCR while these thugs were driving & would have allowed cops to handle the matter.

But it ended well, so good.

Rgds,
Biren

Point to ponder......

Can we IFGians do something to award these brave guards and set an encouraging example for RKBA.

Abhijit...other gurus, please comment.


I am ready to contribute.

Cheers..