Indians For Guns

http://www.abhijeetsingh.com/arms/india/ published in a book covering global viewpoints on gun control http://tinyurl.com/3qvjmze

Cheers!
Abhijeet

Good job Abhijeet - It's people like you who keep the flame burning.\
/S/

mr.abhijeet,
had seen your writing long back,but could not respond.
i wish there were more people like you.
regards.

Great article.
I Think in india guns are only for so called DABANGS and criminals

I'd buy that book if I had $30 but I'm bankrupt now. I may buy when I get some money.

-- Wed Aug 03, 2011 6:23 am --

Kazim wrote:Great article.
I Think in india guns are only for so called DABANGS and criminals

BTW I never saw any cop with a Beretta 92 IRL.

Our cops have British built Lee Enfield .303 rifles which were declared a failure in World War II. The same rifle with which a police constable lay frozen behind cover and didn't shoot at the terrorist in front of him spraying bullets indiscriminately on Indian citizens at CST Mumbai.

Good job Abhijeet - It's people like you who keep the flame burning.\

"One person with a belief is equal to the force of 100000 who have only interests" - John Stuart Mills

British built Lee Enfield .303 rifles which were declared a failure in World War II.

Really? Finding it somewhat difficult to believe. Lee Enfield .303 rifles are fairly accurate, one of the finest and fastest bolt action rifles. Read somewhere that when German troops were attacked by a British platoon armed with Lee Enfield .303 rifles, they retreated and reported that they have come under machine gun fire!

Failure as compared to M1 Garand or some other rifles?

The same rifle with which a police constable lay frozen behind cover and didn't shoot at the terrorist

I do not blame Lee Enfield .303 rifle at all, it is just an excuse created by higher officers to shift the blame on rifles. All that was needed was a properly placed single shot which Lee Enfield .303 rifle can do with perfection. The real fact is that these policemen simply did not have the confidence in themselves that they will be able to hit their targets because they hardly ever practiced shooting.

Really? Finding it somewhat difficult to believe. Lee Enfield .303 rifles are fairly accurate, one of the finest and fastest bolt action rifles. Read somewhere that when German troops were attacked by a British platoon armed with Lee Enfield .303 rifles, they retreated and reported that they have come under machine gun fire!

Then we've both heard conflicting stories or I'm mixing it with some other rifle. However the forces do use Enfield 303. Are they adequate in front of typical automatic fire from the terrorists?

I do not blame Lee Enfield .303 rifle at all, it is just an excuse created by higher officers to shift the blame on rifles. All that was needed was a properly placed single shot which Lee Enfield .303 rifle can do with perfection. The real fact is that these policemen simply did not have the confidence in themselves that they will be able to hit their targets because they hardly ever practiced shooting.

Not blaming the rifle, It did its job when it had to. Something is better than nothing (in front of an automatic's fire). Sad that the man didn't even try. He was armed and duty bound to protect the lives that fell to bullets there. At least try ??

Regards,
Virendra

Are they adequate in front of typical automatic fire from the terrorists?

Surely AK 47 is better for close quarter fighting as compared with Lee Enfield .303 rifle. But this can never become an excuse for not even firing a single shot, keeping yourself comfortably and permanently hidden behind a cover. Surely there are many opportunities when you can fire on the AK 47 wielding guy like when he is changing the magazine etc. etc.

Also there are many other factors that play their role in any fight, like your determination, confidence especially in your weapon, your cover, element of surprise etc. I know of a case where terrorists armed with AK 47s attacked a house at night. The owner of the house immediately took cover behind the door wall and shot dead one terrorist using his 12 gauge DBBL shotgun. Immediately all other terrorists took to their heels.

Not blaming the rifle, It did its job when it had to.

Ha Ha ha! Only the babus blame it when they need an excuse, it becomes an obsolete rifle for them. If we want it for ourselves, the babus will find the same rifle to be so "deadly" that it is still a "prohibited bore" for us!

Virendra S Rathore wrote:Our cops have British built Lee Enfield .303 rifles which were declared a failure in World War II. The same rifle with which a police constable lay frozen behind cover and didn't shoot at the terrorist in front of him spraying bullets indiscriminately on Indian citizens at CST Mumbai.

They would have done the same even if they were armed with a G36 and the excuse would have been that it is a very "sophisticated" weapon and we were not trained properly, hell if they had a G36 they probably would have ended up pawning the weapon....

You have to understand that the Indian police is a relic of the Raj and this police force was not for assisting or protecting the general public, but it was trained for oppressing the general public and they still have that mindset. The majority of them are self opinionated ego maniacs on a subsidized ego trip and moreover they do not have an incentive to save your or anybody's life.

And i would also like to make it clear that i have come across a few dedicated police officers as well. The "exceptions" as i like to call them.

Oh and by the way Lee Enfield .303 is a good rifle.

Whats more, that colonial baggage mentality is witnessed by many firearm license applicants everyday.

Read this on The HINDU website.. seems like a small section of people are waking up...



It is not surprising that Baba Ramdev has decided to raise an Army. Ordinary citizens of India know that the police is just a political puppet. Most Indians would like to arm themselves and take their own security into their own hands. Women cannot travel safely in public places at night. Corrupt politicians eat the national wealth and resources while leaving millions to starve. In India the Poor alone suffer... regardless of religion.
Anna Hazare began a righteous war against corruption. But the Government is now showing that it is indeed anti-people. Ramdev Baba cannot be blamed or condemned for his actions or words. Even in the struggle for our freedom, the moderate phase was immediately followed by an extremist phase. My comments will be moderated because I am an ordinary citizen so I really cannot say all that I feel. But now I really understand why Mahatma Gandhi, the messiah of Ahimsa, had also demanded a repeal of the Arms Act made by the british. He really cared for the people and he knew that the only thing that would ever bring true equality is the gun. The Indian Government has an inherent distrust for its citizens even now. Hence we still have draconian gun laws. Indians generally do not support violence. I am not a violent man. We are not cowards. We are a soft-hearted people.
But it seems to me that now the time has come that we demanded a better India. It is our right. The least the Government can do is clean up its act and set things right. I see poor starve every day. And no matter what I do it seems little. How much more can a soft-heart bear? Or do politicians believe we have all gone blind? I demand the End of Arms Act. And I hope the Government gets my message.

from: Pranoy Kumar
Posted on: Jun 9, 2011 at 10:39 IST

Yeah, doing nothing and blaming it on the rifle is the good ol' babu mentality, Lee Enfield .303 rifles are good rifles for medium range combat actually but really showing their age now. But a well placed shot from any rifle would kill a person instantly and I'm pretty sure they got atleast one chance to put a bullet in the terrorists. Speaking of British laws, the current laws are far worse. At least British did that to the people from another country but now our own people are taking away our rights, not to mention the forced sterilization programme implanted by Indira Gandhi in the 1970s. Oh! did I forget to mention our current gun laws? lol

There is nothing wrong with the SMLE, RFI 2A/2A1, No. 4 Mk. 1, or No. 5 rifles at all. Most people consider them to be the best bolt action battle rifle ever, and I believe that there's considerable justification for such a belief.

There is no doubt, however, that a policeman or men armed with SMLEs facing criminals with fully automatic AK 47s would be at a disadvantage in an urban setting. Still, this does not absolve the police for not firing their weapons at all. They are the public's defense against this sort of mayhem, and even more so when it is the policy to disarm the public in practice, if not legal theory. If the government claims that the public is more safe when citizens are unarmed, then it takes upon itself the responsibility to protect citizens in ALL situations, and excuses to the contrary are not acceptable.

An anti-gun rights person may reply that a civilian carrying, say, an IOF revolver would not have been able to stop those Mumbai terrorists, either. I will grant that, perhaps, that is true. However, it must also be granted that such a civilian has a much better chance at doing so than the approved authority that shirks their responsibility, drops their weapon, and runs.