Indians For Guns

Mack The Knife on his Delhi visit was kind enough to check my nephews air-rifle. It's a Diana Model 25 (.22 cal).

It seems like it may need a new mainspring, washers, piston (?) etc. Any suggestions on where to order these parts from? Does anyone sell a complete overhaul kit - with all the parts one needs to refurbish the gun to fire as new?

Cheers!
Abhijeet

Hi Abhijeet,

I very much doubt you would need a new piston.

Have Lloyd at B.A.R. source you a main-spring, piston washer and a breech seal. A spare set is always worth keeping.

You could also request Ranjeet to send you these parts and you could send the amount to his dad in Bangalore. Germany may be the cheaper option.

Mack The Knife

Or you can try here

http://www.chambersgunmakers.co.uk/Dian ... 20list.htm

-Inder

Strange!

Tried their site this morning and it wasn't functioning. I thought they had shut shop since old man Chambers hasn't been keeping good health.

Abhijeet, Chambers are a respected firm, so don't hesitate placing an order on them.

Thanks, Inder.

Mack The Knife

Mack The Knife/ Inder, thank you The advice and link have been quite helpful. Will also be trying the pellet lube mix mentioned by Nikos, as the pellets my nephew is using are 2 decades old and could be part of the problem.

Will be ordering the parts later this month. Once they arrive I'll begin my first air-rifle overhaul project...

Cheers!
Abhijeet

There is a ready made pellet lube available in UK "Napier power pellet lube". I think BAR must be carrying this but I don't know If this can be used in Spring Air guns.

-Inder

I've heard talk about how the Indian Hume Pipe (National) air rifle model 25 is a copy of the Diana model 25, so thought I would find out for myself if some/ all of the parts were interchangeable. Since spares for imported air-guns are not easily available in India, I thought this might be useful info for others as well....

While I do not consider myself an expert on air-guns, the similarities in design and dimensions become very obvious the minute you have both the guns in front of you.


The Diana 25 (top) & the IHP 25 (bottom) - disassembled for comparison

As you can see the stock design is quite different, also the foresight of the IHP 25 is raised higher than that of the Diana, to compensate for this the IHP 25 rear sight has also been raised, other than that the rear sights of both seem to be identical. There is also a difference in the type of screws used all around - while the IHP 25 uses flat head type screws, the Diana uses Phillips type cross heads - but the threading of the screws for both is the same, with most screws interchangeable between both the guns... a notable exception to this is the Barrel joint stop screw, a small screw which is used to "lock" the larger Barrel joint screw. While the threading of this screw is identical in both guns, the screw used in the IHP 25 has a longer head, which means if used on the Diana it will protrude by about a millimetre or so...


IHP 25 innards - a closer look


Diana 25 innards - a closer look

Another difference - while the Diana 25 employs a set of barrel shims (washer type bushes) on the barrel unit, at the point where it is hinged on to the cylinder (to make the cocking/ closing movement smoother), the IHP 25 has dispensed with these altogether... cutting corners to save money I guess...


Close up of the Diana 25 barrel unit showing the barrel shims


Close up of the IHP 25 barrel unit - note the complete absence of barrel shims

Moving further, the piston units, while similar and in a crunch interchangeable - are NOT identical as can be seen below. The same holds true for the Piston washer units, tirggers and the spring guide.


The Pistons - Diana 25 (top) & IHP 25 (bottom)


The Spring guides - Diana 25 (top) & IHP 25 (bottom)


The Triggers - IHP 25 (left) & Diana 25 (right)

However, the mainsprings seem to be a close match as can be seen below. The IHP 25 mainspring seemed to be a coil longer than the one for the Diana 25, but since the latter was an old one and bent, I would imagine the distortion might be responsible for that dimensional difference.


The Mainsprings - Diana 25 (top) & IHP 25 (bottom)

The trigger housing units are a close match too and are interchangeable, though the IHP 25's may require some degree of sandpapering/ filing.


The Trigger housing units - Diana 25 (top) & IHP 25 (bottom)

Another part the IHP 25 is completely missing is the breech seal! They have done away with this completely as well As can be seen in the picture below, in stead of a breech seal they have plastered the breech with some blackish compound to make it fit snug with the cylinder unit.



In conclusion, while original spares are desirable - one may use many of the parts from the IHP 25 in the Diana 25 as a stop gap and/ or cost saving measure.

Cheers!
Abhijeet

P.S. - Both rifles are chambered for .22 cal
P.P.S - The IHP 25 in .22 cal costs INR 3,495/- tax paid in New Delhi and spares for it may be ordered from the dealer or direct from the factory.

Hi Abjijeet,

Seeing your problem I have also faced the same of getting the spares for my diana air gun model 35 cal .22 for that I contacted G Smith Pune they have spring and seal. I ordered a spring and washer the spring is as good as original diana has. They say that it is made of the same material. I haven't use it but seeing it I think it is good and cost is also very low i.e Rs. 120/- only. For original I contacted bangalore armoury he coated me Rs.1000/- for spring only. So choice is yours.

Regards,

Denzil

Excellent post, Abhijeet. I for one, had never seen the inside of a National air-rifle.

It is no surprise that the rifles are similar in so many respects because if my information is correct, IHP's National air-rifles are made on machinery bought from Diana.

Mack The Knife

Mack The Knife, I think I should add here that while I haven't seen the Diana 35 up close, but did get a chance to compare the IHP models 25 & 35 first hand (exterior comparison only). The latter has a longer barrel and cylinder as compared to the former. I would imagine this added swept volume and maybe a longer (more powerful?) spring in the 35 should mean some performance gain... at least in theory. Do jump in and correct me if I am wrong...

The reason I picked up the model 25, was:

a) It is smaller and easier for the kids to handle.
b) I really wanted to check out if the parts could be interchanged.

As things stand now, I have used the IHP 25's main spring to replace the Diana 25's - to tide over my nephew at least till such time that original replacement parts can be had. Why not just have him use the IHP 25 instead, you ask? Well the Diana shoots just that much sweeter!

Will get another spring for the IHP, the next time I am in the vicinity... I don't imagine they'd cost much, so might be worth grabbing a spare anyway!

Cheers!
Abhijeet

Mack The Knife Bana";p="13140 wrote: Excellent post, Abhijeet. I for one, had never seen the inside of a National air-rifle.

Coming from the resident air-gun boffin, that's praise indeed! Thank you Rusty!

Cheers!
Abhijeet

I would imagine this added swept volume and maybe a longer (more powerful?) spring in the 35 should mean some performance gain... at least in theory. Do jump in and correct me if I am wrong...

Not wrong at all.

Coming from the resident air-gun boffin, that's praise indeed!

Me, a boffin?

By no stretch am I know for my modesty but a boffin I definitely am not.

A little more well read and experienced on airguns than the average punter, especially the Indian punter but nothing more.

Mack The Knife

Let me know what parts you need for the Diana 25. The spring for 35 is available here, that I know, but for 25 I will have to check. Also the price for spares in Dubai might me higher, than what the Pune dealer will quote. Send me a list of what you need and I'll enquire and post you the spares price.

.177 or .22 pellets is no problem. A very large selection is available, specially from GAMO.

A very methodical post done with attention to detail .

Well done Abhijeet .

Mack The Knife Bana";p="13165 wrote:A little more well read and experienced on airguns than the average punter, especially the Indian punter but nothing more.

Mack The Knife

It is now your turn to see me after class ( inappropriate English )