Indians For Guns

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:48 am**

Dear members of the forum,

What I am going to ask is for my understanding. The following questions have been in my mind since I saw the pics of the dead tiger / man-eater of Faizabad. The beauty and the majesticity of the animal, even dead, is what made these questions arise.

We say, Man-eater. Now, is that a state the tiger is in, an affliction to the animal, or is it just a term where-in the tiger kills a man and eats it? Now, if a tiger is a man-eater, is it necessary to kill it?? Can't it be tracked, brought down with anesthesia, rehabilitated or moved to a enclosed area, where there is absolutely no contact with humans??

What I could gather from the net is that the animal becomes a man-eater when man wanders into its area and not vice-versa. Is that true?

And If I am wrong, please feel free to correct me.

Regards

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:02 am**

They can also become man eaters if they are injured. It may be wound inflicted during a battle between two tigers to establish their supremacy or humane inflicted or natural. They become man eaters only in the last resort. Their main aim is to target easy prey such as cattle. And in this condition it is true they become man eaters when human wanders into its area

Bhaskar

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:16 am**

As long as man was a hunter, and lived by hunting, most animals had fear of him, and avoided him when possible. And even though man today may think that he is not of this earth, he very much is part of it.
However, all predators are opportunists, and once they discover how easy it is to kill man; man may become there favorite flavor.
How exactly do you propose to "rehabilitate" a man-eating tiger? Don't think you can convince them to become vegetarians. Yes, you could put them into a fenced park, and keep them adequately fed with live meat. But are you willing to "adopt" such a tiger, and pay for his care?

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:24 am**

TwoRivers wrote: How exactly do you propose to "rehabilitate" a man-eating tiger? Yes, you could put them into a fenced park, and keep them adequately fed with live meat. But are you willing to "adopt" such a tiger, and pay for his care?

A species going on the blink, shouldn't that effort be taken?? As for the willingness in adopting such a tiger, I'm sure we can find a lot among ourselves, me included, who would be willing to do the same.

But why kill?? Why is that the final solution??

“When a man wants to murder a tiger, he calls it sport; when the tiger wants to murder him, he calls it ferocity.” : George Bernard Shaw

Regards

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 12:04 pm**

m24

A big cat turns maneater due to injury or old age. In both conditions it can't chase its usual prey and discovers that humans are easy to prey on.

The Faizabad tiger was shot at and injured in the paw reportedly by a poacher.

A maneater can be trapped and caged as have been the dozen odd leopards in BNP most of which I'll wager are NOT maneaters. They are victims of intrusions by humans in their jungles. And they live a pathetic life in the cages, I assure you. In addition to the above some more "maneaters" were rehabilitated but none made it to their new homes alive including a pregnant leopard who miscarried due to stress and died enroute along with her two yet to be born cubs.

The leopards in BNP are lured towards humans because most of the BNP periphery has been encroached by migrant slum dwellers thanks to FD and local politicians. Slumdwellers create garbage which the BMC won't clear, garbage attracts dogs which are very easy prey for the leopards. Chicken fowl and other animals reared by these slum dwellers also attract the leopards. These slum dwellers go in the jungles for their abulations and fall victim to the leopard when they squat. The leopard thinks the squatting human is his prey and attacks. Voila ! a maneater is made.

Difficult solution : Remove slum dwellers and fence BNP (money is available)
Easy Solution : Trap and cage "maneaters"

Yet another story of mismanagement by all concerned parties.

M.

m24 wrote:Dear members of the forum,
We say, Man-eater. Now, is that a state the tiger is in, an affliction to the animal, or is it just a term where-in the tiger kills a man and eats it? Now, if a tiger is a man-eater, is it necessary to kill it?? Can't it be tracked, brought down with anesthesia, rehabilitated or moved to a enclosed area, where there is absolutely no contact with humans??

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 12:52 pm**

fantumfan2003 wrote:m24

A maneater can be trapped and caged as have been the dozen odd leopards in BNP most of which I'll wager are NOT maneaters. They are victims of intrusions by humans in their jungles. And they live a pathetic life in the cages, I assure you. In addition to the above some more "maneaters" were rehabilitated but none made it to their new homes alive including a pregnant leopard who miscarried due to stress and died enroute along with her two yet to be born cubs.

Yet another story of mismanagement by all concerned parties.

M.

Bottom-line, it can be done, right. It's only the apathy by the concerned officials / people that is converting a conservation process into a killing spree. Correct me if I am wrong.

So then the problem is not the man-eater, but man himself.

Regards

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 1:16 pm**

m24

Bottom-line ? Is that what it boils down to ? m24 this is not business. Of-course it has always been the man and how will you make the situation right ? You think the FD, Ministries and Babus will let you or anybody else set the situation right ? They won't give you the control. They are the biggest hurdle.

M.

m24 wrote:
fantumfan2003 wrote:m24

A maneater can be trapped and caged as have been the dozen odd leopards in BNP most of which I'll wager are NOT maneaters. They are victims of intrusions by humans in their jungles. And they live a pathetic life in the cages, I assure you. In addition to the above some more "maneaters" were rehabilitated but none made it to their new homes alive including a pregnant leopard who miscarried due to stress and died enroute along with her two yet to be born cubs.

Yet another story of mismanagement by all concerned parties.

M.
Bottom-line, it can be done, right. It's only the apathy by the concerned officials / people that is converting a conservation process into a killing spree. Correct me if I am wrong.

So then the problem is not the man-eater, but man himself.

Regards

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 1:21 pm**

m24 wrote:
fantumfan2003 wrote:m24

A maneater can be trapped and caged as have been the dozen odd leopards in BNP most of which I'll wager are NOT maneaters. They are victims of intrusions by humans in their jungles. And they live a pathetic life in the cages, I assure you. In addition to the above some more "maneaters" were rehabilitated but none made it to their new homes alive including a pregnant leopard who miscarried due to stress and died enroute along with her two yet to be born cubs.

Yet another story of mismanagement by all concerned parties.

M.
Bottom-line, it can be done, right. It's only the apathy by the concerned officials / people that is converting a conservation process into a killing spree. Correct me if I am wrong.

So then the problem is not the man-eater, but man himself.

Regards

What are we going to get to cage one more Tiger?

I think people have this big misunderstanding about tiger extinction. Tiger is going extinct in wild not in zoos or personal collections. Last time I checked tiger cubs were sold in classifieds in USA. If you find it uncommon please check http://www.tigerhaven.org/page.asp?page ... 0Reference they even have an advisory page against owing a tiger as a Pet.

I think in place of calling a “Professional Hunter” government should have auctioned the TAG for man eater. I am sure many guys around the world would have spent a fortune to have that chance and all that money could have been used to safe guard rest of the tigers. Off course in INDIA saying this is akin to blasphemy and carry it’s own If’s and but’s but according to me that would have been a wise action

-Inder

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 2:14 pm**

Manish, I used bottom-line as a figure of speech, not as project management lingo. And I've never considered this as business. This is more serious stuff. Please don't make the mistake of thinking that I'm going to make things right. I only want to understand, that's it.

Inder, a cage costs less than a life saved. And understand, I am only talking about wild, man-eaters. And I didn't get this. If you can clarify this:

I think in place of calling a “Professional Hunter” government should have auctioned the TAG for man eater. I am sure many guys around the world would have spent a fortune to have that chance and all that money could have been used to safe guard rest of the tigers.

Regards

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 2:16 pm**

m24 wrote:Dear members of the forum,

We say, Man-eater. Now, is that a state the tiger is in, an affliction to the animal, or is it just a term where-in the tiger kills a man and eats it? Now, if a tiger is a man-eater, is it necessary to kill it?? Can't it be tracked, brought down with anesthesia, rehabilitated or moved to a enclosed area, where there is absolutely no contact with humans??

Excellent thought, and I would welcome it! This is what I call a mindset change!! I found an interesting link. http://www.indiasinvitation.com/dudhwa_national_park/
I am quoting an excerpt from the entire article, which is worth reading.

Billy Arjan Singh the veteran wild life lover is synonymous with Dudhwa National Park his Tiger Haven is situated close to the park he runs rehabilitation centre. Man Eaters are reported in this park but the prime cause of man eating is established as encroachment – upon habitat and interference to the life style of the tigers the other reasons are shortage of food as man-eating is exceptional preference old age with broken canines or incapability to stalk and kill running animals. Park authorities have enterprised in converting man eater tigers to their natural wild feed adherence but providing different environment (thick forest plenty of wildlife including baits) and disapproved the Jim Corbett hypothesis that once a man eater always man eater i.e. opening of a new chapter in wild life conservation as the man eaters are no more target of wild life experts as they try to rehabilitate them than to eliminate them but this hypothesis has also seen certain odds, as the experiment did not succeed in totality although arguments were given that only those tigers, killing man without any direct and indirect disturbance and feeding on him are to be treated as man eaters.

Educating people is the biggest endeavour in the area, as they need to be convinced that tigers are not born eaters of human being (Homosapiens) only aberration or threat to their survival cause change in their eating habits and life style they need to be convinced that like man tigers should not be deprived of their normal right to live on the earth they need to be allowed to live their life and will let others live a normal life.

I know, people will jump saying the experiment did not succeed in totality, but remember, nothing will, in the beginning. There are scientific approaches in conserving a "LIFE" -- be it a "WILD" life or the so called "CULTURED" life. It is worth to employ "Learned, qualified practitioners" rather than Brut force.

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 2:23 pm**

Thank you, srswamy for that link. So, what I mentioned is being looked into. That's wonderful news.

Regards

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 2:37 pm**

m24 wrote: Kanwar, a cage costs less than a life saved. And understand, I am only talking about wild, man-eaters. And I didn't get this. If you can clarify this:
I think in place of calling a “Professional Hunter” government should have auctioned the TAG for man eater. I am sure many guys around the world would have spent a fortune to have that chance and all that money could have been used to safe guard rest of the tigers.
Regards

I meant why not offer MAN EATER for legal Hunting, it would have fetched so much money that all the forest gaurds in UP would have got AK47's, better clothes and footewear.

-Inder

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 2:42 pm**

m24

I misunderstood you.

M.

m24 wrote:Manish, I used bottom-line as a figure of speech, not as project management lingo. And I've never considered this as business. This is more serious stuff. Please don't make the mistake of thinking that I'm going to make things right. I only want to understand, that's it.

Regards

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 3:05 pm**

kanwar76 wrote:
m24 wrote:
I meant why not offer MAN EATER for legal Hunting, it would have fetched so much money that all the forest gaurds in UP would have got AK47's, better clothes and footewear.

-Inder

Inder, that can still be done without killing the tiger. We know why it's not done and let's not even go there. It would become an endless crib session.

I don't know but I strongly feel that whatever can be saved, must be saved, come what may.

Manish:

Regards

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2010 3:39 pm**

m24 wrote: Inder, that can still be done without killing the tiger. We know why it's not done and let's not even go there. It would become an endless crib session.

I don't know but I strongly feel that whatever can be saved, must be saved, come what may.

Manish:

Regards

When government can't even provide ample clean water to our forces fighting in naxal hit areas then AK47 for forest gaurds from charity and other funds seems a far fetched dreams isn't it..

Its a BAD world out there and sadly in this BAD world tigers have to pay for their survival, only problem right now is Tiger is doing the payment already but not getting anythign in return.

-Inder

Indians For Guns

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