Indians For Guns

Interesting that a 1963 date is claimed for this Stutzen (=carbine), as by that time the rifle had a swept-back bolt handle and tang safety. The Greener safety would be a custom addition. On sight, I would have placed the rifle in the interwar period. The front ring on the objective is placed there because the scope has to be tipped to hook up, with the ring in the usual position the bell would hit the barrel before the mount can be engaged. In addition, it provides a longer distance, and thus rigidity and support for a scope with a long and large bell.
M-S calibers, in sequence of introduction, were 6.5x54 M-S, 9x56 M-S, 8x56 M-S, and 9.5x57 M-S. 1921-22, when production resumed, the popular Mauser calibers, plus .30-06 were added. When production resumed in 1952, only the 6.5x54 M-S remained of the original calibers, but all the popular Mauser and and suitable American calibers were added. The magnum action was one of the few actions with front and rear locking, the bolt guide rib being fitted to bear against the receiver brigde, as well as the two front bolt lugs.l

TwoRivers your handle should have been twoSeas you are a sea of knowledge about guns

shukriya
-
Zafar

You're welcome, Zafar. Now, you are making me blush.

MS is legendary in Rifle action design, stock design ( The Mannlicker stock is a generic term in gun circles ) and introduction of new calibres.

All interested must visit their website for more info and knowledgebase.

One interesting observation that I have made about Mannlicher schoenauer rifles is that the M&S rifles in calibers such as 270 and 30-06, kicked like a mule where as the rest like in cal.6.5x54, 9.5x57 were very pleasant to shoot. Probably due to their stock design. Maybe too much drop on the comb and a longish pistol grip caused the guns to slap the cheeks. Yours truly owns one TAKE DOWN MODEL in 6.5x54 M&S in super condition ( made 1927) and a friend picked one up in cal. 30-06 for Rs.one Lac from Bangalore a decade ago. The 30-06 is the one with a squarish bolt release button.(post 1950s). Both have Folding Leaf rear sights sitting on them and my 6.5 has a retractable aperture sight on the tang as well..Any other interesting observations on these superbly made beauts are welcome.
Marksman

Not sure where this thread is going.

TwoRivers: Have you procured a MS rifle. If so please let us know and post results if possible. That would be great.

Marksman: Since when does a 30-06 kick like a mule? You can pretty much slam fire a Garand without any issues, including most importantly recoil. How owuld you rate the recoil on a .300 RUM or a .338 LPM?

MoA,

If you read again,Marksman was speaking about stock design and felt recoil.It's about gun design than the cartridge. I shot 30/06 quite a bit and .303 in SMLE rifles and I always thought the latter kicked harder.The straight stocks and brass butt-plates are what many feel to be the reasons. Care to add your inputs on that aspect?

Best-
Vikram

Dear MoA,
I almost developed a flinch shooting a 12 bore using IOF no.6 shotshell. The shotgun was a well made English sidelock "Grand Prix" with a 2 1/2" chamber. The butt happened to have been made for a rather short man and the gun slapped me hard every time I fired.. Turned out to be a prank my friends played on me as they were aware of the consequences . I am a delicate man who tries to overcome the flinch by handling rightly designed stocks. A thousand apologies friends, for deviating from the main topic.
Marksman

MoA: Had a post-1952 6.5mm, which I let a friend's friend talk me out of, since I had picked up a Greek military action to build one on, and had always thought that a 20" barrel, such as on the 8x56 carbine made for a better balanced rifle than Steyr's 18" in that caliber. Still have a 9.5x57 rifle that came back from Kenya; with its rifling just about worn away, and stock soaked with palm oil, it could probably tell some good stories. This too is waiting to get a new barrel, as it will only do about four inches at a hundred yards on a good day. Somehow or other, some of my own pet projects tend to get shoved on the back burner. As to perceived recoil, how the stock fits the shooter seems to make more difference than anything else, in my opinion. Same cartridge, same rifle weight, but different stock style, and one will be pleasant to shoot, while the other one wallops you. What I normally hunt with is a 9.3x62 on a Husqvarna HVA action, with Niedner steel butt plate, but stocked for me. And I think it's more pleasant to shoot than a few .30-06s I have known. Cheers.

I used to be 110kg a long time ago- a single, 12 ga, 'new art light works' shotty pushed me off a a narrow paddy 'bund ' on my butt!
sustained 3+1 from a CZ 458 WM gave me a swollen finger and thumb, and a nose bleed.A pre 64 mod 70 in 375 gave me my first scope scar..my 450/400 on the contrary , handles like a dream. Kind of quirky, the perceived recoil, and of course,the stock has a major role to play. Some how the European calibers seem to be gentler, compared to the american-but this is a very individual opinion. As for the 338 lapua, guesstimate of about 50-55 ft lbs of recoil?
Yup, found the 9.5 to be a more forgiving caliber...
At 86kg now, I would still shudder to take on an interchangeable barrel Mauser 458-wicked - est recoil on earth, give me a 577 anyday.

And, of course, if you expect it to have an unpleasant kick, and hold it gingerly, it will really let you have it. Worst I ever got was from a .577 Snider carbine with a rifle round, fired from a squatting position. That one tumbled me over backwards and down the hill. Ah, and not to forget the .577/.450 Martini. But there I never could get a good grip and still reach the trigger with my finger. Another unpleasant one was one of a pair of .405 Winchesters that had been "liberated" in Kashmir in '48. The one, a Lee-Speeed by some multi-named London maker, was quite pleasant to shoot. The other one, a Winchester Model 95, though restocked with shotgun type butt, and weighing about the same, kicked like an insulted mule. Yet, there seemed to be little difference in stock fit between the two. Still have a soft spot for the old .405, though. Cheers.

Check out the Full engraved .256 mannlicher (6.5x54mm) rifle of shahid bhai.

Danish

Lovely! An interesting piece, don't see military style sights and rifle length barrel on a 6.5 M-S very often. Would guess this to be a British-build, or re-build, specimen. Cheers.