IOF 315 rifle and cartridge

[z375]

Zubin,

Where did you get the Speer/Sierra/et al?
Now that would be tellin, wouldnt it?? actually for the past six months I've kept my African Grey on a steady diet of old refrigerator tubes and wheel weights....once in while he drops a few every now an then

How did you measure the powder?
Peg measure....quick and deadly!

What powder did you use?
Normally its Yardley's Lavender, but I like Tabac too

How uch powder was in the case originally?
Who cares?? As long as a helluva lot more goes in!!

How did you reseat the bullets?
Try dropping them nose-first from a few storeys, works like a charm!

Where are you buying your gear from? I am certain a number of my friends would be very interested in getting this stuff.
Buying my gear?????? All I need is a damn parrot!

I am assuming at this stage you do know what you're doing,
Absolutely! OMG! How'd you guess????

because what you have posted is essentially an excellent recepie to blow your self up.
Kiss the cook, baby!!!

Cheers...
Hic!! yeah whatever...

[z375]

Eljefe,

I was talking about Sierra/Speer bullets, press, dies etc... didnt know they were available in India.
So we're not the only ones living in a cave, are we??

I am sure if a dealer is able to source the bullets, then logically the rest of the equipment should be available as well.
Duh!!yup, yup, yup!! All we need is strong teeth and peg-measures....

Why would my name be quoted in the speer manual? Did I say it was?
Naah, u got it all twisted....your name's in the "Stay-clear" manual....not the Speer manual


Nor do I share my recipies with my firends unless they are shooting the same caliber.
Please ensure that your recipies, or whatever given to your firends...are strictly of the gastronomical variety....just make sure you exclude the saltpeter and the gelatin! There are far more cures and quick-fixes for upset tummies than for firends whose faces you cant really recognise anymore...

Even then what works for me might not work for them. Every rifle behaves differently.

So what's the secret??? A whip and leathers???


slow your role buddy, wake up and smell what you shovellin!! adios!

[mundaire]

OT posts from the IOF .30-06 thread split and merged with the IOF 315 thread....

MoA, z375 - let's put a cap on this silliness...

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[penpusher]

In continuation of the discussion I have had with two of the members:-

http://www.corbins.com/intro.htm

http://shop.rcbs.com/WebConnect/MainSer ... 09J155N142

http://shop.rcbs.com/WebConnect/MainSer ... &route=C10

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... t=11082005

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... t=11082005

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=423081

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=454722

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=822768

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... t=11082005

Anything else?

[MoA]

Abhijeet,

Appreciate your time spent tracking down what pieces of equipment could possibly be needed.

Collet pullers and chornos are generally unnecessary for most getting into reloading.
I personally do have a couple of collet pullers since getting light claibers apart is painful with a kinetic puller.
And I dont use a chrono, simply because I am interested in accuracy over velocity. Yes it will help with the ES etc.. but if a load is printing sub .25 inches at 100 it tells me more than a chrono...

But that is digressing. The information being spread on what constitutes safe and accpeted reloading practise is very different from what I see here.

I couldnt care less about what some Edited has to say. And further more could even care if you decided to ban me.

Not going to change a thing for me, or the [edited] ...

Cheers.

[Sakobav]

MoA

I think it was penpusher not Abhijeet who gathered the info in his post above and at times like this some sense of humour goes a long way. Cool it off a bit and hope to see you around.

Cheers

[penpusher]

MoA,

What are the unsafe re-loading practises that you are talking about.The pressure at which the IOF 315 cartridge operates is not a state secret.As long as the chamber pressure is within this,there should be no problem.The caliber is .323.I will be reusing the bullets.I will be reusing the powder and loading within the max./ min. powder the factory loads the cartridges with.I will ensure that the cartridge is of the same length and that the bullet is seated to the same depth without crushing the powder and without leaving any air pockets.I will be using proper tools for reloading.So how do you say that the rifle will blow up?

A vernier caliper and an electronic weighing scale should be enough to tell you everything that you need to know about the cartridge.

Reloading does not require a degree in rocket science.Lot's of dumbos are doing this for decades without blowing themselves up.Reloading data would be required if I were to experiment with different powders/loads.Since the purpose is to operate within the factory parameters and to use the same powder that the cartridge comes with I don't know why you are crowing about "unsafe" reloading practices.

I will not be reloading in the real sense of the word.

The factory loaded ammo. is not consistent in it's performance.The bullets are not seated properly and in some cases are canted.The bullet dia also varies.There is a variation in the powder that the cartridge come loaded with, leading to a wide variation in the velocity.All this affects accuracy.The purpose is to remove these variables and have a cartridge that shoots consistently.There is a problem with the bullets,but at this stage ,I will be using factory bullets,but checked with a micrometer before loading.

I don't expect you to climb down from your high horse,but at least try to comprehend what we are saying.

[MoA]

It isnt the people who are trying a consistent 39-42.. the range youre seeing in the loads. Consistency is good...

There is dowright dangerous information being posted. I dont have a high horse. Just a firend who blew himself up.
Fair enough... I will go out of my way to try and get people to be safe.

Do a 5/4.. assuming 40 in the 5th that you spilt and 40 in the others...
You end up wit 50 with the stated 220... without running rumbers...

50 gr of anyting in 8mm seems like a lot. I still need to measure my cases in a sligtly larger caliber...

Lets take the powder... a .02 inch difference can make a difference of upto 8000 psi dependent on where you are in the chamber,

Also how many of you actually know... less is the way to go with heavier bullets..

[eljefe]

Good, atleast we are getting some valuable info in here, on 're manufacturing', state of 315 standardisation and advice from a reloader. So keep it on the spirit of the things, let the good times flow , hopefully to ensure the flow of 'better ' events in the times to come...no pontification, would truly appreciate an informative , gigabyte strong thread- all good, safe and usable info.

[shahid]

What moderation in chamber pressure would be required if a Morris tube is fabricated and used in a 12 Bore DBBL ( say BSA or IOF DBBL ) to fire .315 rimmed cartridges.

It is a hypothetical situation of course, just for the knowledge for Morris tubes of .315 are extremely tough to get or fabricate.

Given a choice I would ove to have a .315 Double except for the fact that quality of IOF ammo is so inconsistant.

Are there any improvements of late in the new lots of KF, .315 ammo or it is still the same old standard ?

[penpusher]

It isnt the people who are trying a consistent 39-42.. the range youre seeing in the loads. Consistency is good...

There is dowright dangerous information being posted. I dont have a high horse. Just a firend who blew himself up.
Fair enough... I will go out of my way to try and get people to be safe.

Do a 5/4.. assuming 40 in the 5th that you spilt and 40 in the others...
You end up wit 50 with the stated 220... without running rumbers...

50 gr of anyting in 8mm seems like a lot. I still need to measure my cases in a sligtly larger caliber...

Lets take the powder... a .02 inch difference can make a difference of upto 8000 psi dependent on where you are in the chamber,

Also how many of you actually know... less is the way to go with heavier bullets..

[TwoRivers]

Shahid: I don't think that anyone would be able to tell you what .315 chamber pressure a BSA or IOF 12 gauge double could stand on a sustained basis. If a reduction in pressure from the standard .315 were required, how would you come up with those cartridges?
Since the .315 is obsolete in Europe, and is a non-standard 8mm, even though an 8mm "S" barrel would work fine, insert tubes would be strictly custom. They'd probably run you 1,000-1,500 Euro a piece in Germany or Austria. If I just wanted the capability to fire the .315 from my double, I'd get a 8x57S M98 surplus barrel, cut the chamber end seven millimeter and turn it down to fit the shotgun barrel. That would be the quick and dirty way, without proper sights, and a cleaning rod taking the place of the extractor. Quite a few years ago we had a barrel maker who made an insert barrel that had its own breech lock with firing pin, and so did not depend on the strength of the shotgun action. But that was slow and cumbersome and never became popular, though it sounded like a good idea. Are you able to import a rifle barrel into India? Cheers.

[MoA]

Cartridge : 8 x 50 R Mannlicher M93 (DWM358)
Bullet : .323, 200, Speer Spitz-SP 2285
Useable Case Capaci: 61.431 grain H2O = 3.989 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.190 inch = 81.03 mm
Barrel Length : 26.0 inch = 660.4 mm
Powder : IMR 3031 ?

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-20.0 76 40.00 2281 2311 30231 5988 99.6 1.625
-18.0 77 41.00 2329 2409 32162 6092 99.8 1.586
-16.0 79 42.00 2376 2507 34208 6185 100.0 1.549
-14.0 81 43.00 2422 2605 36352 6267 100.0 1.513
-12.0 83 44.00 2468 2704 38599 6345 100.0 1.474
-10.0 85 45.00 2513 2804 40969 6422 100.0 1.435
-08.0 87 46.00 2557 2904 43470 6498 100.0 1.398
-06.0 89 47.00 2601 3004 46111 6572 100.0 1.363 ! Near Maximum !
-04.0 91 48.00 2644 3105 48898 6645 100.0 1.329 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 93 49.00 2687 3206 51841 6716 100.0 1.296 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+00.0 94 50.00 2729 3308 54948 6786 100.0 1.264 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0 96 51.00 2771 3410 58230 6854 100.0 1.234 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 98 52.00 2813 3513 61697 6920 100.0 1.204 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+06.0 100 53.00 2854 3617 65361 6985 100.0 1.176 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+08.0 102 54.00 2895 3722 69236 7048 100.0 1.149 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+10.0 104 55.00 2936 3827 73336 7109 100.0 1.123 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 94 50.00 2800 3482 65600 6546 100.0 1.186 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 94 50.00 2620 3048 44347 7141 100.0 1.371 ! Near Maximum !

PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS IS WITH 200 GRAIN BULLET. VALUES FOR A 220GR WILL BE USING LOWER AMOUNTS OF POWDER.

[MoA]

And data with a 220 grain Nosler:

Cartridge : 8 x 50 R Mannlicher M93 (DWM358)
Bullet : .323, 220, Remington PSP CoreLokt
Useable Case Capaci: 50.910 grain H2O = 3.306 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.190 inch = 81.03 mm
Barrel Length : 26.0 inch = 660.4 mm
Powder : IMR 3031 ?

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-20.0 87 38.12 2280 2540 38543 5379 100.0 1.553
-18.0 89 39.07 2326 2644 41271 5447 100.0 1.509
-16.0 91 40.03 2372 2748 44155 5513 100.0 1.465 ! Near Maximum !
-14.0 93 40.98 2417 2853 47212 5578 100.0 1.424 ! Near Maximum !
-12.0 96 41.93 2461 2959 50469 5642 100.0 1.385 ! Near Maximum !
-10.0 98 42.89 2505 3065 53942 5704 100.0 1.348 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-08.0 100 43.84 2548 3172 57646 5764 100.0 1.312 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-06.0 102 44.79 2591 3280 61598 5822 100.0 1.277 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-04.0 104 45.74 2634 3389 65818 5879 100.0 1.244 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-02.0 106 46.70 2676 3499 70329 5933 100.0 1.212 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+00.0 109 47.65 2718 3610 75153 5985 100.0 1.181 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0 111 48.60 2760 3722 80319 6035 100.0 1.152 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 113 49.56 2802 3835 85856 6083 100.0 1.123 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+06.0 115 50.51 2843 3949 91800 6129 100.0 1.096 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+08.0 117 51.46 2885 4065 98189 6172 100.0 1.069 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+10.0 119 52.42 2926 4182 105067 6212 100.0 1.044 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 109 47.65 2775 3762 89989 5776 100.0 1.118 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 109 47.65 2632 3383 60382 6296 100.0 1.271 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

[MoA]

Cartridge specs...