Indians For Guns

Friends,

I was hesitant about where to post the topic 'Guns Misc' or 'Handguns'. I finally chose the Handguns. Excuse me if I am wrong.

Here is my passion of Muzzle loading (Black Powder) handguns for competitive target shooting. My interest is totally in competition (handguns only) and hence all the guns are made for that specific purpose; crisp trigger (except for one), adjustable sights (wherever it is permitted), high quality material and craftmanship and off course fine barrels.
They are all replicas. I can not afford to have the Originals which shoot well.

The worldwide Competition governing body is MLAIC (Muzzle Loaders Associations International Committee) where you will find rules and disciplines we shoot both with handguns and long guns at different distances.
http://www.mlaic.org

In many European countries including France, official championships are held at the district, regional and national level according to the MLAIC rules. MLAIC organises European and World Championships every 2 years.

A few words on Muzzle loaders in competitions.

By definition, any original weapon manufactured before September 1873 can be used for the MLAIC competitions in 'Original' category. Any exact replica (look and mechanism) of guns made before September 1873 can be used in the 'Replica' category.
So all replicas are made today with modern CNC machines but has to be approved by MLAIC for competiton use.
For the shooting rules, ISSF rules are generally followed.

Handguns are shot at 25m on a C50 target both in original and replica categories. Revolvers are shot at both 25m and 50m. Long guns are shot at 50m, 100m, 300m to even at 1000 yards on varied target sizes according to the gun and distance.
Till 300m, rules are:
13 shots in 30 minutes. No sighters. Best 10 shots are counted. More than 50% of the impact has to be inside a ring to be counted. For example, if an impact is touching the 9 ring but more than 50% of the diameter of the impact is on the outer side, it will be counted as 8. So the counting process is a bit frustrating.

Here is the picture of all my babies, all together . The mechanism and lock of one (the one with the barrel & grip only) has actually gone for repair . I want it back as soon as possible pleaseeeee!!! The rest are fine. I will describe them individually including what they are capable of, in later posts if you are interested. Till then...

Enjoy!
tirpassion

Tirpassion.

Thank you for an interesting and educative,post.Your babies look good.Especially those revolvers.


Best-
Vikram

Fascinating

Of all the various ML handguns you use, which do you find most accurate, and what load and loading technique do you follow.

tirpassion wrote:Friends,
I will describe them individually including what they are capable of, in later posts if you are interested. Till then...

Enjoy!
tirpassion

What a fantastic collection.
I am sure every one would love to read more about them. Please describe them individually with more close up (snaps) whenever you get the time to do so.

Tirpassion: thanks for posting these! I'm thinking the disassembled weapon is an under hammer pistol known here as a "boot pistol" kit -- is this correct?

The one that interests me most is the matchlock. Echoing Prashant's request, I'd appreciate a description of shooting it, especially things like lock time and how that affects your shooting style. Also, if you can address the effects of different kinds of weather and how you deal with shooting in different conditions, I'd like that, as well!

You are bang on the target Tim!
It is indeed an Underhammer pistol. The replica of the 'Barlow Underhammer' pistol in .40 caliber. This particular one is made by Ardesa / Traditions in Spain. The barrel is an exceptional one made by Ueli Eichelberger in Switzerland, a legend in BP shooting. It has 6 grooves RH twist 1/16" (1 twist in 16 inches). The whole gun weighs about 870g which is quite light. Overall length is 39cm. The barrel is 235 mm long. The trigger weight is finely adjustable; 200 to 500gms approx. The system is a direct trigger.

The Barlow underhammer should look like the picture below. It is a very precise and accurate gun perhaps even better than modern weapons. The underhammer percussion system adds to the lightening fast lock time, hence the precision. It is surely one of my favourite pistols.
I use 14 grains of 3fg Swiss Black Powder, .395 self cast lead round ball with a .007" (0.18 mm) cotton lubricated patch and no filler. The caps are RWS 1075.

In the picture below you will see the groupings. There are 20 shots at 25m on C50 target. For shooting ISSF rules apply, i.e. single handed. This target was shot with .400 self cast lead balls with a friend's Barlow and it shoots better with .400 than .395 balls.

So, to begin with, I talked about my baby whom I am missing the most right now

warm regards
tirpassion

Thanks to all of you for your interest. I am honoured.
to be continued...

tirpassion: As I understand it, the under hammer allows a direct flame travel from the percussion cap to the powder charge, rather than forcing the flame to make a 90°bend, as in conventional percussion locks. Also, the exploding cap is under the barrel, rather than next to the shooter's face (more of a concern with bench rest rifles). This made them the choice for target work.

Your pistol sounds like it is a real pleasure to shoot, and therefore your enthusiasm is quite understandable! I can imagine that the trigger, as you describe it, is a delight to use.

Hello friends,

I am happy to present to you today, my 1858 Remington Navy replica revolver in .36 caliber. It is made in Italy by A.Uberti but has a precision barrel called 'Adler lauf' or Eagle barrel by Hege, Germany.
Type: Single Action only
Weight: 1.2 Kg, barrel length: 7&3/8", adjustable dovetail front sight (lateral adjustment only) cylinder capacity: 6 shots
trigger pull weight: Around 500 gms

The 1858 Remington was used in the American Civil war and here you will find more informations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remington_Model_1858

The load I use: 12 grains Swiss 3Fg, semolina filler and self cast . 380 pure lead balls. RWS 1075 caps for percussion. The chambers are sealed with self made grease after loading. This grease allows to keep the barrel clean, prevents leading and allows a smooth passage of the ball.
Each chamber is filled with powder followed by medium grain semolina and the ball is seated in with the loading lever which you see in the photo.

This is how it looks like when ready to fire. It is obviously not loaded

I talked about the adjustable dovetail front sight. It is only in the case of Replica revolvers for competition. Once adjusted definitely, the dovetail has to be rasped and aligned with the octagonal barrel. Otherwise, the weapon will not be allowed in competition. Te reason is that the originals did not have any adjustable sights.
This is a very precise weapon. Here is a photo of a C50 target shot at 25m during the adjustment/testing period. I leave it for you to judge.

best regards
tirpassion

to be continued...

Aloha,

Are you Allowed to have Extra cylinders for the Remingtons?

hello yogibear,

Here in France it is allowed. In fact, all Black Powder Muzzle loading guns are free weapons which can be bought just by presenting an identity card and proof of residence.

best regards
tirpassion

tirpassion wrote:Hello friends,

I am happy to present to you today, my 1858 Remington Navy replica revolver in .36 caliber. It is made in Italy by A.Uberti but has a precision barrel called 'Adler lauf' or Eagle barrel by Hege, Germany.
Type: Single Action only
Weight: 1.2 Kg, barrel length: 7&3/8", adjustable dovetail front sight (lateral adjustment only) cylinder capacity: 6 shots
trigger pull weight: Around 500 gms

The 1858 Remington was used in the American Civil war and here you will find more informations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remington_Model_1858

This is my fav from your collection. Very handsome revolver, someday eh .

Hey dev,
the next time you visit Paris, we will make sure that you shoot whatever you wish from my humble collection . You can add on a Free Pistol and also a .22LR bolt action rifle.

best regards
tirpassion