Colt 1911 38 Super or Ruger GP100 357 Mag?

[Grumpy]

"1. Get the required parts and have a licensed dealer fit them, to legally change the calibre to a NPB one."

Oh yeah ? With respect Abhijeet, where are you going to find a gunsmith in India who can fit the new barrel to the new slide ? You could have it done by a gunsmith in the US......or buy a pre-assembled top end complete. I still don`t see the point in getting anything in .38 Super though because of the lack of availability of ammo.
9mm Parabellum is the obvious choice - if allowed - but a 1911A1 in 9mm Para is an insult to a fine pistol...............................
- although it doesn`t make much difference if all you intend to do is to sell it I suppose.
Youi`ll need to bling it up though for maximum profit .........a stainless slide on a blued frame would look pretty.....along with Pachmyr wrap-round finger-grooved grips, high visibility three dot sights........and how about a compensator ?

"Grumpy other than a complete top end, i think the frame feed ramp on most 45 frames is cut much deeper into the mag well and at a steeper angle than frames made for 9mm/38 Super/10mm. This difference can cause feed jams when trying to convert such frames to smaller calibers."

Mashh1 - the frame ramp angle IS different depending on the calibre but actually presents little problem as the ramp can be built up with weld, or filed back - depending on what is required - and the angle altered to suit.

[mashh1]

Grumpy have you seen barrel with the supported chamber, do they have an integeral feed ramp, if so they can save the cost of altering the feed ramp. As you have yourself mentioned that there are not gunsmith who can fit another barrel then i dont think they can alter the feed ramp. Moreover Abhijeet dont trust a smith to tweak with his gun for repair of thumb safety as he mentioned in a previous post.
regards

[Grumpy]

It`s such an easy job that it could be done by Abhijeet himself - the top end supplier would be able to advise on the angle required.

[Sakobav]

nice pistol

best

[mashh1]

yes grumpy with complete instructions it does not sound a difficult job.
thanks & regards

[saahil]

hi nawab sb. of hyderabad
firstly i would like to congratulate for possessing a beauty more beautiful then anything available in our country.
secondly i would like to ask the seniors to please clarify that if its in .38 calibre which is a prohibited bore in india as per my knowledge,how you managed to place your hands on such a beauty.im not questioning your possession but im just curious to know weather im ignorant about pb and npb.thanks.take care.

[cottage cheese]

hi nawab sb. of hyderabad
firstly i would like to congratulate for possessing a beauty more beautiful then anything available in our country.
secondly i would like to ask the seniors to please clarify that if its in .38 calibre which is a prohibited bore in india as per my knowledge,how you managed to place your hands on such a beauty.im not questioning your possession but im just curious to know weather im ignorant about pb and npb.thanks.take care.

.38Super (in the case of nawabs gun) is an NPB.

To clarify again, Prohibited Bores(Speaking of ammunition and not weapon type) are simply those which were and are in field service with the Government, police and Military.

Here's a list of ammunition in service with the Govt.

.380Webley
.38 S&WSpecial
9mm Para
.455Webley
.45ACP
.410
.30 US Carbine
.303
.315
.30-06
7.62mmX51mm NATO
7.62mmX39mm M43 Soviet
7.62mmx54mm R
5.56mm
5.56mmx30mm
12Bore

Exceptions are :
12Bore
.315
.30-06

[penpusher]

.30 carbine and .38S&W Special are NPB's..30 semi-auto carbine is in the prohibited list as it is a semi-auto rifle and not because of the caliber.If .38S&W special was a PB so would a .357Mag.The definition of a PB firearm is one that can fire a PB cartridge and you can fire a .38 special cartridge in a .357 Mag revolver.Contrary to what we would like to believe,not all people in the Home Department are dunces and some of them are pretty fond of firearms.

[HSharief]

Ashar bhai, my recommendation is to keep the colt. You already have a colt revolver in 357/38, getting the ruger will just double up on the same caliber and kind of pistol you have. Although some purists may not like me very much for calling the Ruger and Colt a same kind of revolver. You already have a much superior Colt revolver and although you might not get 38super ammo as easily or as cheaply as 357/38 I'd say just stick with the Colt 1911 as it is really a masterpiece that you must be proud to possess. Like someone else has pointed out, you can very well afford, by God's grace, to have the 1911 so Please don't part with it.

[mundaire]

"1. Get the required parts and have a licensed dealer fit them, to legally change the calibre to a NPB one."

Oh yeah ? With respect Abhijeet, where are you going to find a gunsmith in India who can fit the new barrel to the new slide ? You could have it done by a gunsmith in the US......or buy a pre-assembled top end complete. I still don`t see the point in getting anything in .38 Super though because of the lack of availability of ammo.
9mm Parabellum is the obvious choice - if allowed - but a 1911A1 in 9mm Para is an insult to a fine pistol...............................
- although it doesn`t make much difference if all you intend to do is to sell it I suppose.
Youi`ll need to bling it up though for maximum profit .........a stainless slide on a blued frame would look pretty.....along with Pachmyr wrap-round finger-grooved grips, high visibility three dot sights........and how about a compensator ?

"Grumpy other than a complete top end, i think the frame feed ramp on most 45 frames is cut much deeper into the mag well and at a steeper angle than frames made for 9mm/38 Super/10mm. This difference can cause feed jams when trying to convert such frames to smaller calibers."

Mashh1 - the frame ramp angle IS different depending on the calibre but actually presents little problem as the ramp can be built up with weld, or filed back - depending on what is required - and the angle altered to suit.

Hmmm... Unfortunately 9mm Para is also a PB calibre in India. NPB options could be .38 super or .22 LR (I believe drop in conversion kits in .22 are readily available)... not sure about any other calibres for which ready made 1911 kits are available...

Was actually thinking of option 2 of having multiple barrels (in different cals) entered on my license, don't really intend to sell the gun... I will have to check further on the feasibility of acquiring parts and relevant permissions though....

Cheers!
Abhijeet

[penpusher]

Abhijeet,

You will have to obtain permission to buy a barrel in another caliber and also the barrel would have to have been legally imported into the country ie before 1986 or by a shooter/NRI post 1986.Import of parts of a firearm is prohibited and therefore you can't just bring in a barrel and then ask for it to be entered on your license.You can however obtain permission to change the caliber of the firearm.There after you will have to obtain a license to export and then re-import the pistol(since it is an imported firearm).Then you can take the firearm with you when you go abroad(sending a firearm through post/courier is prohibited).On return, you will be charged duty on the perceived increase in value of the firearm after the 'repair'.

This is too much of a hassle.If I were you I would use the money to get some custom work done on it.This again would have to be done in in USA.Buy some good quality mags and work on finding a source for the ammo

[penpusher]

Read some where that a company sold hi-capacity replacement frames for the 1911 .45.Mark would be the one to know about it.

[cottage cheese]

Read some where that a company sold hi-capacity replacement frames for the 1911 .45.Mark would be the one to know about it.

Didn't ParaOrdnance make High cap .45s?

[cottage cheese]

.30 carbine and .38S&W Special are NPB's..30 semi-auto carbine is in the prohibited list as it is a semi-auto rifle and not because of the caliber.If .38S&W special was a PB so would a .357Mag.The definition of a PB firearm is one that can fire a PB cartridge and you can fire a .38 special cartridge in a .357 Mag revolver.Contrary to what we would like to believe,not all people in the Home Department are dunces and some of them are pretty fond of firearms.

Hi SSS,

Well...I was simply going by what the act is supposed to convey: Service ammunition is PB.
.38S&W Spl is in service so...my deduction That's another grey area...and another clause open to interpretation. Thus, I'd consider 357Mag a fortunate grey area

No argument on .30 carbine. I thought it was used by the Paras at some point so there.

...and about the Home Department?... I'm not changing my mind

[mashh1]

Para Ord start making hi capicity frames for single stack guns, which are called wide body frames before they start making complete hi cap guns.