Indians For Guns

The MTs-255 tactical shotgun is a 5-shot weapon and is designed around the revolver principle. The cartridge cylinder swings out to the left for loading/unloading. It can be fired either double-action (a long pull of the trigger both cocks and fires the weapon) or the hammer can be manually cocked for single-action firing. A heavy duty, single-strut metal side-folding stock is fitted, which pivots around a conventional style revolver pistol-grip and lies alongside the right side of the gun when in the folded position. Sights are described as 'open', but a length of Picatinny-type sight rail is fitted to the top of the receiver for the mounting of other sighting devices. The butt-plate, pistol-grip and fore-end are all constructed of high-impact polymer for durability and corrosion resistance.

The original MTs 225 was introduced as a hunting gun back in 2000. It has an interesting design. The benefit over semi-autos would be its double action revolver reliability.

Those Russians sure do come up with some interesting designs. Too bad none of them are sold here ! However I feel that on a Revolving shotgun, the cylinder should open on the right side to facilitate right handed reloading.

What say guy's


SAM

Intresting Gun, Don't know when will we have the opportunity to own something like these.


Ravi.

Having used reliable semi autos - this type would really have only novelty use ! For practicality and tactical use its a semi always.

Most police depts still use pumps, around here anyway. Less maintainance and the potential to reliably cycle so called 'less lethal' loads(runner bullets, etc).

Yes, this gun will likely just be a curiousoty anywhere that pumps and self loaders are legal. However, it appears to be well made and it's an attractive design, IMHO. Kind of reminds me of the ancient Colt's revolving rifles.

Any info on what gauges it is available in?

And I believe that the cyllinder is designed that way so a right handed shooter can maintain a firing grip on the weapon while reloading. Just a guess.

-- Fri Feb 05, 2010 8:24 am --

Further thoughts...I see no way to seal the cyllinder. If it's not sealed, the firer had better not grap that forearm while firing! It's a Russian design, no? They should design a nagant style sliding cyllinder to seal that gap, and then a proper shotgun hold could be used.

12 gauge. Also, as you can see in the pictures, there is a shield attached to the crane, protecting the left hand and arm. That may be the reason the cylinder swings out to the left. As a hunting gun I see problems with the double action pull coordinating with your swing. Flock shooting, maybe. A Nagant-style cylinder would require special shot shells! Cheers.

TwoRivers wrote:12 gauge. Also, as you can see in the pictures, there is a shield attached to the crane, protecting the left hand and arm. That may be the reason the cylinder swings out to the left. As a hunting gun I see problems with the double action pull coordinating with your swing. Flock shooting, maybe. A Nagant-style cylinder would require special shot shells! Cheers.

I also wonder about the handling what with the massive cylinder it has. What kind of special shot shells that a Nagant-style cylinder requires? Any links to pictures and literature?Thank you.

Best-
Vikram

I'd suspect that it might be possible to operate such a shotgun in a gas seal mode, like the old Tsarist Nagant revolver:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagant_M1895

A number of old designs used a gas seal to eliminate the loss of pressure that occurs through the gap between the cylinder and the barrel.

If you follow the description of the role the cartridge case plays in the process, as described in the wiki article, I would think that based on this, it might be possible to make it work in a revolving shotgun. In such a case, if the cylinder was long enough to contain the expanded shell, i.e., with the crimp opened completely, except for a small amount, this small amount would then serve as the seal for the barrel/cylinder joint. Of course, the more of the crimp that extends into the barrel, the more that the cylinder must move backward and forward so that, when the cylinder is rotated to line up the next chamber, the cylinder withdraws sufficiently to extract the extended part of the case (hull) from the barrel to allow rotation.

Since the expanded length of the hull is all part of the system -- the taper of any shotgun's chamber must be long enough for the crimp to expand and not block the bore, which is of a smaller diameter (same as the shot cup), there is a tolerance in the manufacture of hull expanded length that would determine the amount the cylinder would have to move back to allow rotation.

Even though revolver ballistic performance does suffer from gas leakage (compare velocities from a revolver vs. a Thompson-Center handgun, for instance), nobody thinks the complications of the monkey-motion needed to move the cylinder back and forth are worth the relatively small advantage offered.

I also found this article on the Nagant revolver:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... ntent;col1

You'll note that the author's attempt at humor is pretty silly, since he admits that Nagant was a Belgian and the gun was designed for the Tsarist, not the Soviet, regime. However, his comments about the gas seal system's lack of utility is properly (in my opinion) noted.

Regarding the MTs-255, I'd note that (at least for me), the novelty of the design is a big part of the pleasure of owning a particular firearm. In this case, I cannot note anything in the pictures that indicates to me that the shotgun uses a gas seal system. However, I think that one downside to it is the reloading operation. Perhaps someone will make a speedloader for it? ;^) However, I think that it would have been better for it to work along the lines of the "Schofield," or break-open action, like the old British service revolvers -- extraction and loading would be much easier and quicker than with a swing-out cylinder.

Even though there's a lot of excess weight in the action and cylinder, in particular, at least it's in the center of the gun.

Vikram: The Nagant gas-seal requires a cartridge with the bullet seated below the case mouth, the round slightly longer than the cylinder, and the case mouth entering the barrel. So case length has to be controlled, and uniform. The gas shield used serves the purpose and is simpler. But the gun is not made for lefties!

That massive cylinder could be made of titanium, or even an aluminum alloy, to keep the weight down. But being concentrated "between the hands", the weight may even contribute to a lively balance. No way to tell without handling, though. Cheers.

Thank you,Timmy and TwoRivers, for your very interesting posts.

One more question.In the Nagant revolver,the cylinder is loaded through a loading gate one at a time while in case of this shotgun the cylinder swings out.The Wiki articles says that the former is the price for the gas sealing design.How can we explain the latter design,of the shotgun in question, in light of that design limitation?Thanks and I hope my question is clear.

Best-
Vikram

Vikram, not sure if this is what you are driving at, but here's a diagram of the 1895 Nagant:



This isn't very clear picture. Here's a parts diagram page:

http://www.buymilsurp.com/pictorials/m1 ... orial.html

Without taking one apart myself, or at least without a better breakdown, I'm unsure exactly how the cylinder is pushed forward to make contact with the barrel. Specifically, I'm not sure if only the hand pushes the cylinder forward (besides rotating the cylinder) or if it does so by interacting with the recoil plate. (#34 in the parts diagram and the lavender part in the color diagram.)

If the cylinder moves forward, it's clear that, unless excessive headspace is tolerated (which it clearly isn't), something must take up headspace behind the cartridge base when the cylinder moves forward.

I'm sure something like this could be managed with a swing out cylinder, but it is a whole lot simpler if the cylinder's pivot is fixed. Note that, even with the gas seal feature, there really aren't too many parts in the 1895 Nagant revolver.

What I think I see as a seal in the MTs-255 doesn't seem to involve moving the cylinder fore and aft. Looking at this pic:



seems to indicate that the whole face of the cylinder is recessed, except for a slight rim. Then, on the crane, there is a shield fitted that engages under the rim on the cylinder face to protect the shooter's arm from gasses jetting out of the barrel to cylinder gap.

There doesn't seem to be any space in the frame of the MTs-255 that would allow the cylinder to move fore and aft.

Hi Guy's,kindly click on the following link,maybe it can help shed some light

http://s901.photobucket.com/albums/ac21 ... =slideshow


SAM

This would be PB in India..

diskaon

What about this:
STRIKER

"The weapon's action is similar to that of a revolver, using a rotating magazine. Since the Striker uses a more or less conventional double action only trigger, and a very large and heavy cylinder (compared to handguns), Walker added a pre-wound clock-work spring to revolve the magazine. This proved to be a slow and ineffective way to load the weapon. The design was changed so that there is now a cocking lever on the right side of the barrel.The Striker is somewhat unique for a shotgun because of its twelve round capacity and short overall length."
Love it in cod:mw2

I believe Dwarka Arms, Bellary, did try to manufacture a 5 shot 12ga revolving shotgun... and got into an awful lot of trouble with the authorities. There was a protracted case in this regard...

http://www.indiankanoon.org/doc/1057463/

Is the gauge of this revolver shotgun 12, 16 or 410? Me thinks the 410 would be sleek, less weight thus ideal for wing shots. Secondly I think there would be no ejector mechanism to this. While over under, pump action and auto loaders are in vouge, nothing to beat the sheer look, feel and handling of the good old 'side by side' with a choice of barrels (choke & cylinder) with ejector mechanism.
Cheers
Brihacharan