Indians For Guns

LUCKNOW: A senior army officer in Bareilly allegedly ordered an army jawan to undergo a medical fitness test in place of himself. The lapse was detected but not before the jawan not only got himself medically examined but also went ahead to sign the document in place of the real applicant, only to vanish into thin air once the fraud was detected.

It all began on Friday morning when two army jawans arrived at Bareilly District Hospital for a medical fitness certificate. After due registration, the jawan -- posing as the applicant seeking the certificate -- appeared before a senior doctor for the check-up only to be declared fit by the attending doctor, who also attested the signature of the applicant seeking the certificate. Finally, when the file reached medical superintendent (MS), Dr Vijay Yadav, he discovered that the photograph of the applicant on the form on which the medical certificate was to be issued did not match the person posing as applicant before him. When a surprised MS questioned the individual if he has signed the document in column meant for the signature and attested photograph of the applicant, the army jawan boldly replied in the positive.

According to Dr Yadav, the application form identified the applicant as Lieutenant General (Lt Gen) PS Tavar, Cantonment, Bareilly. The certificate was reportedly sought for submission with the application for an arms licence. Dr Yadav, reportedly, not only refused to verify the document but, also cancelled the certificate. He then reported the matter to his senior, the CMO, who in turn brought the matter to the notice of the DM.

When contacted on Sunday, Dr Vijay Yadav refused to talk claiming that he had "directions from the top" to keep mum on the issue. CMO Dr A K Tyagi said that he has brought the matter to the notice of DM Anil Garg. The DM, in turn, admitted that the incident had taken place, but he was clear that they were not initiating any action into the incident. "It is for the army to take action," he said. Interestingly, when asked if he had intimated the army authorities about the issue, he hung up saying: "Please get back to me later".

On the other hand, legal experts in Lucknow insist that the incident is a fit case of "fraud'' under the Indian Penal Code, and must not be overlooked merely because it involves a top army officer. "No matter who the person is, if an individual applies for a government verification and presents someone else in his name for the job, it is fraud. There is no way that one can overlook this blatant crime," said senior high court lawyer, Atul Verma.

Source: http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 802952.cms
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So now they have started harassing arms license applicants by asking for "Fitness Certificates" for issuing arms licenses. So the old, weak, disabled do not have any Fundamental Right of Self Defense or Fundamental Right to Keep and Bear Arms. Even an Army officer whom Government of India considers physically fit to be in Army to defend the Nation, has to prove to civilian arms Licensing Authorities that he is physically fit enough to defend himself and his near and dear ones.

goodboy_mentor wrote: So now they have started harassing arms license applicants by asking for "Fitness Certificates" for issuing arms licenses.

Well said Goodboy mentor.
It is not only harassing an applicant but I have noticed that every time I get my licence renewed there are new rules coming up. I remember the last time I went to the police station where my arms are registered I was asked to submit a passport size photograph (for record purpose) which they later attached infront of my name and the details of the weapon I have.
This time the Officer at the police station asked me to show them my weapon so that they could verify the number entered on it. I told him that the weapon has to be shown at the SDM's office for verification and not at the Police Station. He signed the application , but added that this is a NEW RULE and from the next time I would have to come with the weapon to the station as well.
Strange.

Yes probably all these rules are to harass arms license holders so that they gradually give up their firearms. There are many people who feel insulted for being made to report to Police Station and getting their photographs affixed in Police records like those of criminals or getting their firearms "inspected" by Police. It is probably far worst now than it was happening during British Raj. At least those who were once issued arms license they were not insulted by Police. One of my colleagues was telling me that his father had a double barreled gun some years ago. Whenever there used to be some violent crime in area, the Policemen would visit his house to "inspect" his gun and "count" the cartridges. These regular visitations by Police to his house would create unnecessary negative gossip in neighborhood. He got so insulted and fed up that he sold his gun and surrendered his license.

Admit it or not, it takes hell lot of guts for a Jawan to pose as a Lt General. Muse be an ideal candidate for the Oscars

BD

Folks, I was thinking of applying for a arms license, can someone advise what kind of physical training regime I have to follow? Only walking would suffice, or weights and all, or extreme commando training? Can one also get the rules which prescribe the limits for physical fitness (e.g. blood pressure above 120/70 does not get a license....)?

I mean, it would have been funny if it were not so tragic. God save India!

Amen!!!

[quote="essdee1972"]Folks, I was thinking of applying for a arms license, can someone advise what kind of physical training regime I have to follow? Only walking would suffice, or weights and all, or extreme commando training?



Ha ha ha that would be great I would atleast get fitter and our gun community in India would be healthy, we might be called to defend our nation in times of need with the 22's and shotguns that us mortals could own(this will be the next rule for sure).

reg,
drifter.

well done the jawan, it goes to show how corruption has eaten into the very depth of armed forces let alone our society at large. (not all the forces members are corrupt i am sure but it gets harder by the day to say who can one trust)

if one is FORCED into criminal activity to obtain arms licence then let us not be aghast if some do break the law, the law is obey able but the enforcer of the law are despots to say the least.

nagarifle wrote:well done the jawan, it goes to show how corruption has eaten into the very depth of armed forces let alone our society at large.

About 20 yrs ago an uncle of mine (a serving Brigadier) applied for an arms licence. All he did was call up the D.M. and the S.P. and spoke with them.The relevant papers were filled and sent. The next day his licence was ready. A serving Lt. Gen. in the station is the senior most gazetted officer (appointed by the President of India) and needs NO introduction.
A Lt. Gen. in the Army is equivaleny to a Chief Secretary in the I.A.S. or a D.G. Police.
Would an S.P. ever call a D.G. Police to his office for Police Verification?
or
Would a D.M. call a Chief Secretary to his office for an interview?
I doubt it.

remembered the movie 'where eagles dare'

more than anything its a shame..and as a army jawan.we always had a high opinion about army.things like this makes us feel sad .hope it was the only incident.

thats Lt. gen S P Tanwar.
Dr. Jayakumar.. An army jawan cant really say no to an officer, leave alone a lt gen. the fault is with the officer in this case. the jawan might be ge guilty in the eyes of the law or might not be but the officer is wrong here.

Gentlemen it is not the question of what Army jawan did or what General did. The reply of nagarifle and prashantsingh has precisely identified the problem and answered the question. It the question of what the rotten state of affairs, insult, humiliation and harassment the arms license applicant is made to go through.

goodboy_mentor wrote: It the question of what the rotten state of affairs, insult, humiliation and harassment the arms license applicant is made to go through.

Exactly.
A few months ago I read an article in the News Papers which mentioned that one of our service Chief's had been frisked by an airline staff at some Airport during a security check.I don't remember which Chief it was. A debate had subsequently followed and most people had questioned why an Officer of that rank should be frisked in the first place.
As far as the promotions in the Army go , all Officers have to undergo a medical examination by a board of Army doctors before picking up their next rank. A senior officer of the rank of a Lt Gen is expected to be healthy ---- physically and mentally.
How does the District hospital come into the picture?